Acceptable Noise Levels for Web/Print

[David Levinson]

Most of us display our photos on the web these days. Depending upon where I'm posting a photo I'll downsize it to 1200px on the long side and to 72 dpi and often down to 80% quality. Those constraints create a reasonably sized file of good viewing quality. Now I'm reading that 1920 px and 96 dpi may be a better for viewing on newer monitors but oh well I might as well post full resolution if I'm going to worry out into the future. This information is a primer to my main question.

What do you (this is subjective) think is an acceptable level of noise on a photo at the web resolutions described above and then what do you think is an acceptable level of noise on a photo that is to be printed at about the 11x14 size (depending upon the crop ratio used)?

I ask because some years ago I was doing a bunch of stock photography where the goal was absolutely zero noise requiring at that time 100 ISO and perfect lighting and then some good noise software and/or using tricks in photoshop to get past the review process.

Now, when photographing birds with a 1DX and a 500mm lens + a 1.4xTC I'm usually at 800 ISO minimum which in perfect light is close to noiseless but in anything but perfect light requires noise reduction. And since I let ISO auto-adjust if my shutter/aperture combination is too low for 800, I am sometimes photographing at up to 5000 and higher. (I try to keep the lighting so that I stay at 1600 ISO and under but things happen quickly when photographing birds at times.)

Recently, I'm finding that when I look at a file in DPP that there is either a little or a lot of noise. I've been wrestling with myself (not a pretty sight) about how much noise I need to get rid of to make the image look OK. I'm always wondering if a pixel peeping web friend will hassle me about the noise and if that matters. I also sometimes look at a photo a week later and think darn, I should have removed more noise. And above all that, the noise isn't usually visible in a printed photo and so I start to think what is my goal really.

Anyway, this is an internal struggle that I have. I'm coming to realize that some noise is OK just like grain was OK and even desirable for artistic reasons when I used to take photos with Tri-X back in the film days.

I'm curious what others think. I'm pretty sure this is a subjective issue.

Thanks, David

[Don Lacy]

David, My personal preference is to have little to no noise in solid color or OOF areas of my images for web viewing, when it comes to the subject and details I would rather have a little noise over blurred details that come with to much NR.

[arash_hazeghi]

Most of us display our photos on the web these days. Depending upon where I'm posting a photo I'll downsize it to 1200px on the long side and to 72 dpi and often down to 80% quality. Those constraints create a reasonably sized file of good viewing quality. Now I'm reading that 1920 px and 96 dpi may be a better for viewing on newer monitors but oh well I might as well post full resolution if I'm going to worry out into the future. This information is a primer to my main question.

What do you (this is subjective) think is an acceptable level of noise on a photo at the web resolutions described above and then what do you think is an acceptable level of noise on a photo that is to be printed at about the 11x14 size (depending upon the crop ratio used)?

I ask because some years ago I was doing a bunch of stock photography where the goal was absolutely zero noise requiring at that time 100 ISO and perfect lighting and then some good noise software and/or using tricks in photoshop to get past the review process.

Now, when photographing birds with a 1DX and a 500mm lens + a 1.4xTC I'm usually at 800 ISO minimum which in perfect light is close to noiseless but in anything but perfect light requires noise reduction. And since I let ISO auto-adjust if my shutter/aperture combination is too low for 800, I am sometimes photographing at up to 5000 and higher. (I try to keep the lighting so that I stay at 1600 ISO and under but things happen quickly when photographing birds at times.)

Recently, I'm finding that when I look at a file in DPP that there is either a little or a lot of noise. I've been wrestling with myself (not a pretty sight) about how much noise I need to get rid of to make the image look OK. I'm always wondering if a pixel peeping web friend will hassle me about the noise and if that matters. I also sometimes look at a photo a week later and think darn, I should have removed more noise. And above all that, the noise isn't usually visible in a printed photo and so I start to think what is my goal really.

Anyway, this is an internal struggle that I have. I'm coming to realize that some noise is OK just like grain was OK and even desirable for artistic reasons when I used to take photos with Tri-X back in the film days.

I'm curious what others think. I'm pretty sure this is a subjective issue.

Thanks, David

Noise/grain is usually distracting and unacceptable for subjects such as birds and wildlife. For some subjects it may acceptable or even desired as artistic.

With the 1DX AND DPP it is possible to get files that have no visible noise up to ISO 6400 (assuming good exposure) when presented at any size (I usually save at 1920 pixels or FHD to fit my large screens). However you need to use optimized RAW conversion settings, and advanced noise reduction to achieve these results.

with the right workflow you should get files like this exmaple : http://ari1982.smugmug.com/Avian/Rap...3cNs2&lb=1&s=O

Canon 1DX, ISO 5000. DPP conversion.

[David Levinson]

Thanks both Don and Arash for posting answers.

Arash, beautiful photos and at ISO 5,000. I'm impressed with both your work and the quality at 5000 ISO.

You use optimized RAW conversion settings and advanced noise reduction on DPP or you are using other third party software?

[arash_hazeghi]

Hi David, I use DPP for RAW conversion which provides a clean file to start with and then use neat image in PS to selectively remove any remaining noise on the feathers or BG. all the details are in my guide.

best