Is this an Iceland Gull?

[denise ippolito]

I shot this in NJ in Nov. of last year. It looks like a juvenile but not sure.

[John Chardine]

Denise- This one will open up a can of worms I'm sure! It is an immature gull, that much I know. I'll do some research.

Next ................

[John Chardine]

Denise- Do you have any other images showing different features and what made you think it was an Iceland?

[denise ippolito]

No- I only got this one.I, I thought because the beak is hooked down

[Dan Brown]

Hi Denise. I don't think that this is an Iceland gull based on what I can see and refering to my Nat. Geo field guide. It looks to me to be a first winter bird. According to my guide, a first winter Iceland would be very, very light, almost white and the eye would be much darker. Also, the bill would be darker and thinner. I know that gulls are "variable" in many ways, so we will see what the "experts" say when they start chiming in on this image.:D

[Jeff Nadler]

way too dark for me to think it is an Iceland

[Dave Brown]

Hi,


Denise- the hooked bill would not be a reason to suggest that this gull is an Iceland. Many gulls can show "hooked" bills. The Iceland/Thayers Gull complex can be extremely difficult and it is not something that I will get into here. Newfoundland is perhaps the best place in the world to view large numbers of Kumliens Iceland gulls,comfortably and at close range. There isn't anything to me that suggests that this bird is an Iceland gull. However, it looks as though this bird might have had an entirely black bill and that would be somewhat unusual for a 1st winter Herring Gull. First winter Thayers Gull would have an all black bill at this date, but it would be extremely unusual for a 1st winter Thayers to show a pale eye like this bird, so I think that species is ruled out. The bird is way too chocolate brown to be a Greater Black-backed or Lesser Black-backed Gull. Therefore, the only reasonable identfication that can be made here given the the information we have to go on would be 1st winter Herring Gull.

Speaking to Jeff's comment that this is way too dark for an Iceland Gull. Most places in the world that would be true, and certainly true for glacoides Iceland Gull. However, Kumliens Iceland Gull can be almost dark chocolate brown. I have photos of a few of these from Newfoundland in winter. They look like excellent Thayers Gull candidates in plumage, but they are spot on Kumliens Gull in structure. I think there is still quite a bit of work to be done on this complex and I feel that some birds cannot be reliably identified in the field.

Dave Brown

[denise ippolito]

Thankyou all for your efforts. I didn't realize how many diff. types of gulls there are.

[Peregrine Craig Nash]

I think possibly Larus smithsonianus American Herring Gull Juvenile with a bit of help from Gulls of Europe, Asia and North America by Klaus Malling, Olsen and Hans Larsson

[Arthur Morris]

Hi Dave, Were and when in Newfoundland for great ICGU photography?

Can you post and adult or two somewhere?

[Dave Brown]

Hey Artie,

Iceland Gulls are arriving right now. By mid January ,when the lakes have hopefully frozen there will be several thousand within St.john's city limits. There are two primary places for Iceland Gull photography, The Pier 17 sewer outflow at the St.John's harbour and Quidi Vidi Lake ( 3 min drive away). Quidi Vidi lake just might be the place in the world to view gulls in winter, not to mention the regular wintering flock of Tufted Ducks and Eurasian Widgeons, that allow photography at extremely close range. You could literaly leave your hotel and be getting killer pics of Iceland Gulls within 5 minutes. Also, many of the gulls that rest at Quidi Vidi Lake become very tame and allow very close approach. You would rarely need more than a 300mm lens to get full frame shots. I don't have much time right now,but I will dig out a couple of Iceland Gull shots and post them here. All of the best winter birding and bird photgrapy areas in St.john's are located witihn or close to the city- you rarely have to venture far from your vehicle and there are almost always amenities close by.

Dave

[Arthur Morris]

Hey Dave, Thanks a ton. You have intrigued me big time... How would March be in an average year in terms of birds and weather?

[Dave Brown]

Hey Artie,

I responded to you via email- hope you got it! If you would like, send me a list of target species and I will give you the best location and probability of getting good photo ops of those species. Also, if you need advice on Hotels etc, I can provide that as well. Quidi Vidi Lake can be fantastic in winter..also potential for great Dovekie photography within 1-2 hours from St.John's. Last year there was a Dovekie in Quidi Vidi Lake!!

Dave Brown

[Arthur Morris]

Hey Dave. Got your e-mail. Thanks a ton. Been swamped. Am trying to finish a Bulletin right now and then have to pack to fly to Bosque tomorrow am but need to leave for the airport motel at 3pm today. Yikes.

You will hear from me soon; I am serious about coming.