Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: The squabble

  1. #1
    Avian Moderator gail bisson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Posts
    12,428
    Threads
    887
    Thank You Posts

    Default The squabble

    Attached Images Attached Images
     
    Evening grosbeaks squabbling on a dark, cloudy day.
    I wish I had more room on the left. Spot focus was on the right bird and no time to switch to the left bird.
    Canon 1 DX3, 600mm v.3
    ISO 3200 F4 SS 1/2500
    Crop to 60% FF, Topaz Denoise and Topaz AI to the eye area of the grosbeak on the left. Thanks to Topaz Denoise I have not been afraid to shoot at ISO 3200 and 4000.
    Nothing added or cloned
    Comments and critiques always appreciated and learned from with thanks,
    Gail

  2. #2
    BPN Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Sunrise, Fl
    Posts
    2,709
    Threads
    423
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Great interaction with sweet BG, perch and framing (yes to a little more on left). Another stunning canvas from you (so, what's new). TFS

    ps
    Love the attitude on left bird, "Like, whatever..."

  3. Thanks gail bisson thanked for this post
  4. #3
    BPN Member Brian Sump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Golden, CO
    Posts
    1,370
    Threads
    129
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Gail, you've done such a nice job with this species so far. Really been enjoying them.

    That warm, magenta center really adds to the frame and two sharp subjects is never hard to like. The only thing I can think of to help it would be losing the vertical branch on left, just because it's so close to the edge but hardly worth mentioning.

    Though I don't have exp with the 1 DX3, I'd say your PP handled the higher ISO really nicely.

    Curious, do you run the birds and everything else through denoise separately or altogether?

  5. Thanks gail bisson thanked for this post
  6. #4
    BPN Member Krishna Prasad kotti's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Eagle Mountain, Utah
    Posts
    2,567
    Threads
    460
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Cool shot with Interaction.

    I would dodge the face of the bird on the left side.

    TFS
    https://krishnakotti.smugmug.com/

    Arise! Awake! and stop not until the goal is reached.
    -- Swami Vivekananda

  7. Thanks gail bisson thanked for this post
  8. #5
    Macro and Flora Moderator Jonathan Ashton's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Wirral UK
    Posts
    14,200
    Threads
    2,125
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Attached Images Attached Images
     
    Gail I would not be concerned about ISO with 1DX III when I had the 1DX Mk1 I could get good results at ISO 25600 so your Mk111 will be a few stops better.
    In situations like these I frequently try to engineer the scenario so that I can optimise the composition so in a case like this I feel a zoom lens may have been beneficial in terms of optimising composition. I do note however that this is 60% so recomposition would have been possible. If you didn't have time to move the focus point it is sometimes worthwhile just focus locking and recomposing, i.e. get the first shot, lock focus and move the lens and the second one is in the bag! I would probably have gone for f8 on a full frame camera.
    I like the squabble it is always good to capture behavioural aspects. I feel the image is a little heavy and by adjusting the darker elements and some subtle changes in contrast and saturation you can get more detail. I attach a modification for your consideration, I think there is more detail around the eyes and neck. .........but I am not sure if you will like it, I know you like images with a little more punch than I.

  9. Thanks gail bisson thanked for this post
  10. #6
    Avian Moderator gail bisson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Posts
    12,428
    Threads
    887
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Hi Jon,
    Thanks for the rework. I like it. Looks better.
    The squabble only lasted a millisecond so no time to focus and recompose. I was actually focused on a third bird that was out of the frame on the right . I was trying for a take-off shot when the bird on the right in this image flew in between the 2 birds. I had time to swing camera on the middle bird only.
    But I get what you are saying !
    Thanks,
    Gail

  11. #7
    Avian Moderator gail bisson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Posts
    12,428
    Threads
    887
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Curious, do you run the birds and everything else through denoise separately or altogether?[/QUOTE]
    Hi Brian,
    99% of the time, I never run DeNoise on the bird. This image is one of the few times I ran DeNoise on the bird separately. I did not use "Auto" for the bird but chose a "custom made" NR and sharpen. I usually use "auto" for the BG though.
    Gail

  12. #8
    BPN Member Brian Sump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Golden, CO
    Posts
    1,370
    Threads
    129
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gail bisson View Post
    Curious, do you run the birds and everything else through denoise separately or altogether?
    Hi Brian,
    99% of the time, I never run DeNoise on the bird. This image is one of the few times I ran DeNoise on the bird separately. I did not use "Auto" for the bird but chose a "custom made" NR and sharpen. I usually use "auto" for the BG though.
    Gail
    Thanks for sharing Gail. Your PP is typically excellent!

    I asked here specifically as the branches looked a little rigid and maybe I'd say, fake-ish if that's a word. Kinda feel like letting Topaz run auto can be dangerous at times so I'll user select anymore (avoidng auto). But I'm still perfecting my PP so hopefully you take it with a grain of salt.

    Something you might also consider, if you do not already is running a Denoise on the whole layer at the beginning, on the raw in PS at the level you want the birds at (say 10/0 or maybe 7/0 - which it's worth noting you are likely better off not letting Denoise sharpen the subjects for you and doing it with SS/USM at the end, which is why you might select 0). Especially if there is a good bit of noise, as I believe running a round on the whole layer helps eliminate noise remnants and/or 'halos' around the birds. And then if you want, you can create a mask for the subject, duplicate the background layer below the bird and you can run a separate round of denoise on the bkg if you feel you want it.

    Oh, PS appreciate Jon's repost but I personally like the og better.

  13. #9
    BPN Limited Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Posts
    109
    Threads
    24
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Very nice interaction Gail! I find myself wishing the branch on the left was out of the frame, but cropping it would place the bird on the left to close to the frame. Still an excellent image. I like the repost as well but find myself preferring the OP. Nice work!!

  14. #10
    BPN Member Bill Dix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Princeton, NJ
    Posts
    12,099
    Threads
    1,830
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Great interaction; good quick reaction to the situation. Nice work getting detail in the white secondaries. Yes I'd like a bit more room on the left, or no branch at all, but you take what you're given. I like the OP.

  15. #11
    BPN Member Dorian Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
    Posts
    2,253
    Threads
    201
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    So jealous you have access to these! They are so pretty. The interaction is great, and I think the tiny cones add interest. Yeah, the branch at left is a bit distracting but you kinda need to keep it in this instance.

    The left bird does look very smoothed out, but its tough to tell how much of that is being OOF versus NR. I also agree with Jonathan's 'heavy' comment and feel the blacks could be boosted as mentioned.

  16. #12
    Avian Moderator gail bisson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Posts
    12,428
    Threads
    887
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    "The left bird does look very smoothed out, but its tough to tell how much of that is being OOF versus NR. I also agree with Jonathan's 'heavy' comment and feel the blacks could be boosted as mentioned.[/QUOTE]"
    Hi Dorian,
    Yes, I was thrilled to have these birds at my feeders for about 10 days but they have sadly moved on.
    The left bird looks smoothed out because of DOF issue. I only used NR at 4 (Topaz)on the birds so very minimal.

  17. #13
    Avian Moderator gail bisson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Posts
    12,428
    Threads
    887
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Sump View Post
    Thanks for sharing Gail. Your PP is typically excellent!

    I asked here specifically as the branches looked a little rigid and maybe I'd say, fake-ish if that's a word. Kinda feel like letting Topaz run auto can be dangerous at times so I'll user select anymore (avoidng auto). But I'm still perfecting my PP so hopefully you take it with a grain of salt.

    Something you might also consider, if you do not already is running a Denoise on the whole layer at the beginning, on the raw in PS at the level you want the birds at (say 10/0 or maybe 7/0 - which it's worth noting you are likely better off not letting Denoise sharpen the subjects for you and doing it with SS/USM at the end, which is why you might select 0). Especially if there is a good bit of noise, as I believe running a round on the whole layer helps eliminate noise remnants and/or 'halos' around the birds. And then if you want, you can create a mask for the subject, duplicate the background layer below the bird and you can run a separate round of denoise on the bkg if you feel you want it.

    Oh, PS appreciate Jon's repost but I personally like the og better.
    Hi Brian,
    For the birds,I used NR at 4 or and sharpening at 12. I will try not using sharpening at all. As I said before, this is one of the rare times I have ever used NR on the bird so it is a new tool for me. Thanks for the advice. I appreciate it.
    Gail

  18. #14
    BPN Member William Dickson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Fife, Scotland
    Posts
    6,594
    Threads
    916
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Lovely colours Gail.....Great interaction and detail on the main subject...I feel that the OOF bird shows slightly too much NR used. Not sure about the presence of the branch on LHS...

    Will

  19. #15
    BPN Member Andreas Liedmann's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Dortmund / Germany
    Posts
    7,778
    Threads
    814
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Hi Gail cool birds , lovely interaction between them .
    Sadly with some technical shortcomings that could not be solved under the given circumstances ( DOF ) .
    Overall nice colors and tones ... Jonīs RP is quite good , a matter of taste . I like both versions .... your OP has more punch which I usually prefer , as long as nothing is clipped in the histogram .

    TFS Andreas

  20. #16
    Publisher Arthur Morris's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Indian Lake Estates, FL
    Posts
    31,087
    Threads
    1,372
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    I prefer the original post. I am not a fan of grey blacks :). My favorite parts of the image are the face of the bird on our right and the little cones.

    with love, a
    BIRDS AS ART Blog: great info and lessons, lots of images with our legendary BAA educational Captions; we will not sell you junk. 30+ years of long lens experience/e-mail with gear questions.

    BIRDS AS ART Online Store: we will not sell you junk. 35 years of long lens experience. Please e-mail with gear questions.

    Check out the new SONY e-Guide and videos that I did with Patrick Sparkman here. Ten percent discount for BPN members,

    E-mail me at samandmayasgrandpa@att.net.










  21. #17
    Avian Moderator Stu Bowie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Centurion, South Africa
    Posts
    21,277
    Threads
    1,401
    Thank You Posts

    Default

    Hi Gail, great interaction, especially capturing an open beak from one, and the other not wanting to share what ever he has in his beak. I do like the curved perch too. Killer smooth BG to make everything pop.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Web Analytics