light and shadow photoshop CC

[Giovanni Frescura]

Hello
When I use light /Shadow in cs I have a defoult and I decided for this to avoid the problems made by this function (too much noise....)
My setting is :

31-31-195- 30-30-200 +20-0- 0,01 - 0,01
What you say about ?
Thanks for your replies and discuss to find a better regulation
Gio

[Diane Miller]

If the default is just a starting point, that's fine -- but each image is different and the best positions of those sliders will vary, and so will Exposure, Whites, Blacks and the other settings such as Curves and White Balance/Tint.

Yes, any adjustment to Shadows or increasing exposure will bring out noise that is in the image. The less adjustment you need, especially to lighten Shadows and increase Exposure, the less noise you will bring out. That will vary with the initial exposure (less if you expose to the right and then lower it in raw conversion) and the sensor. Its best to minimize potential noise by getting the lighting perfect so you don't need any tonal manipulations, but that means there are a lot of situations where you wouldn't shoot.

But noise can be dealt with in software reasonably effectively -- Neat Image, Nik's DFine and Topaz DeNoise are three I use. There are others but I'm not that familiar with them.

[Giovanni Frescura]

Yes it is right thanks.
Normally I use Tpaz for noise reduction sing it in different setting for sudject and backround.
Many times I am no happy about this working becouse expecially in black pint noise is no good (off course if I see the image at 300%) and I would like reduce it more.
I trided also with the other programs but it is the same becouse if you use it too much I leses details ; Nrmally I try to reduce noise immediatly after raw conversion to avoid it..
Could you give me any noise'workflow to try ?
Some people said me that the best could be use o different programs (topaz and neatimage) in different moments and with different setting ..but n said me how!
About light/shadow do you think is better avoid it (if no very necessary ) and works by curves to reduce noise problems ?
Thanks

[Diane Miller]

You can reduce noise somewhat in LR/ACR -- there are tutorials on the internet on how to use the sliders. But it only works to a small degree. (And the program does some NR behind the scenes when you first open an image.) There are no miracles for noise except to minimize it in capture.

Then in PS sometimes noise will be brought out even more with things like Nik Detail Extractor.

I don't have a specific workflow, because each image is so different. I will usually try Topaz, Nik Dfine and Neat Image, and just see which one works best. For Neat Image you can try both the default profile for the ISO, etc, or let it read the noise (the box in the upper left) and see which is best.

If NR is too strong, you can reduce the opacity of the layer, or mask it.

I find the Highlights and Shadows sliders to be powerful and wonderful, but Shadows will bring up noise, as will anything that lightens the dark tones where noise is hiding. I use it as needed to maximize the image, but no more, then deal with noise later. I don't think lightening darks with Curves will give less noise. The noise is already there in the digital capture -- you are just making it visible.

[Giovanni Frescura]

You can reduce noise somewhat in LR/ACR -- there are tutorials on the internet on how to use the sliders. But it only works to a small degree. (And the program does some NR behind the scenes when you first open an image.) There are no miracles for noise except to minimize it in capture.

Then in PS sometimes noise will be brought out even more with things like Nik Detail Extractor.

I don't have a specific workflow, because each image is so different. I will usually try Topaz, Nik Dfine and Neat Image, and just see which one works best. For Neat Image you can try both the default profile for the ISO, etc, or let it read the noise (the box in the upper left) and see which is best.

If NR is too strong, you can reduce the opacity of the layer, or mask it.

I find the Highlights and Shadows sliders to be powerful and wonderful, but Shadows will bring up noise, as will anything that lightens the dark tones where noise is hiding. I use it as needed to maximize the image, but no more, then deal with noise later. I don't think lightening darks with Curves will give less noise. The noise is already there in the digital capture -- you are just making it visible.

Thanks a lot
So abut workflow you think could better use reduce noise after setting with curves ,..vibrance...light/shadov...sharpening ?
I decided do it as the first to avoid noise increasing by sharpening.
Thanks
Gio

[Diane Miller]

For your question, for me there is no hard rule. My approach, which is basic, is to try to minimize noise at capture by the best exposure (and trying to avoid having the dark shadows of full sun that I would want to lighten later). But I won't limit what I shoot -- if the light is "hard" when I have an opportunity, I'll deal with it as best I can later.

Then in LR I will almost always leave the sharpening and luminance NR at the default values. If an image is very noisy I may do a little careful NR, and if it is a good shot but a little soft, I might move the Sharpening slider up a little. (You can find on the internet how to use the other sliders in the Sharpening and Luminance NR sections, to do the best job.)

Then in PS if I do things that bring up even more noise (which is common) I will do NR there. But the two will always work against each other -- sharpening will bring up noise and NR will cause softening of fine details. If NR softens detail, you can't get it back by sharpening. But the best NR software, especially Neat Image and Nik Dfine, can do a very good job. And there may be others I don't know about. Always look at the image at 100% when you use them. You can do NR on a separate layer and mask out the subject if it becomes a little soft. I almost never need to do that.

One a JPEG has been exported for web display, it can be sharpened a little to improve its appearance, but the master file is what it is. There is a limit to what you can do to improve it.

[Don Lacy]

Giavonni, The shadow/highlight adjustment tool is a blunt instrument that as you notice often increases noise and since it is a global adjustment I never use it. When I need to increase shadow detail I will first use the sliders in ACR during the Raw conversion and if the image I will then use a curve adjustment and layer mask to fine tune any areas that might still need it. When using a curve adjustment click on the eye dropper in the dialog box then click on the area you want to adjust and pull the curser up this will put a point on the line that corresponds to that tonality. When you have the adjustment the way you want it fill the mask with black and paint in the adjustment with a soft edge brush only in the areas you want it. I also agree with Diane that's its best to get as much detail as you can during the capture of the image.

[Diane Miller]

I read Giovanni's comments as being about the Shadows and Highlights sliders in LR / ACR. But now I see he meant the Shadow-Highlights adjustment in PS. I agree with Don that is isn't the most sophisticated solution -- it is "old technology." And even if someone does use it, the best numbers would be different for each image.

I was referring to the Shadows slider in LR / ACR, which are very powerful. It (along with the Highlights slider) is similar to Nik's Detail Extractor, but it is doing its work on the full tonal range of the raw data. The Shadows slider doesn't really lighten shadows, rather it increases local contrast in the darks, which of course brings out any noise. (No free lunch with this stuff.)