Hi folks
post another scary thing , taking the freedom to post it here and not in OOTB , if the mods think (i hope not)it should be there , move it , but then i will stop exploring and posting this stuff and go the standard way.
No exciting story behind , this nice KTP male just walked straight into my lens , that`s what i was thinking when i took the image back in 2005. Image taken at Qubitje .
Some base processing as previous , Bleach Bvpass at low settings ; B/W conversion as intermediate step at 50% opacity ; color separation in LAB at very low percentage .Pushing the color leftover in LAB to the final state ; Dodging and Burning. Added some canvas on top , cut off something from bottom.
basically the original FF.
Canon EOS 1D MK II
EF 500 IS L
BB on car door
F 6,3 ; Iso 100 ; 1/200 sec , techs could be better ,easy to say in 2014.
Just to clarify i want to go off the beaten track , it is not an accident , even if some of you will think. I would call this a High Key Bleach Bypass effect.
Wonder what i will get now
Your comments and thoughts are welcome as always good or bad.
Was looking at your previous post and thought Rachel tweaked it beautifully - sorry I did not "post" my thoughts earlier while I was viewing the image, I do so now. This lion - the way the image is processed - would make a lovely print, in my opinion. Very contrasty and striking. I would love to see a B/W version of this, I believe you had a relatively sharp image to begin with (despite the 1/200s) and nice detail where it counts. I really like that slight movement blur on the front paw, the expression on the lion's face, and the point of view - would love to see a new version of this sometime, something more "Peter Delaney" style, something sketchy, hi key, what do you think?
Well done, every image you touch has something unique and challenging, it is never boring, you constantly make us wonder "what's next?"
Have a wonderful evening, Andre here is complaining that he is struggling with PPW, have you any idea what he is talking about?
Hi folks post another scary thing , taking the freedom to post it here and not in OOTB , if the mods think (i hope not)it should be there , move it , but then i will stop exploring and posting this stuff and go the standard way.
Andreas, as you are in your 'exploring mode' and this does fall out of the normal 'arena' for feedback, what kind of feedback are you looking for? If you go this route which is more on the processing side, you need to help us, both Member & Mod in what you are looking for in the content & type of reply, as I think this could be limited?????
cheers
Steve
Post Production: It’s ALL about what you do with the tools and not, which brand of tool you use.
Thanks Gabriela for your comment at least you understand why i post this kind of images and write your thoughts , i appreciate that.I told Andre , that PPW is not easy stuff , you need to try and more important read the manual that comes with it…. very important.
Oh Steve - it is easy at least for me . Just tell me your thoughts about this frame , it is not about PP or whatever , just as an image what it stands for ,your critiques.If one post an B/W image , you do not ask him what he is asking for , do you.
So i hope you see my point and tell me whatever you think about this . The crop, the tonality , the design, the colors just give suggestions what i can make better , or what i should have avoided.
In here i wanted to intensify the intense stare of the lion leaving the majority of the other content alone , less color is more , i posted the image some time ago in here in a normal way.Just another vision, leave to you what you think about or what you see.
Andreas, I have been reading the thoughtful & sincere exchanges about you exploring a somewhat different approach to your images. I applaud you for taking that step publically and I believe it will encourage others to follow. As you know, I am a moderator in OOTB forum so consider me the choir. I fully support your directions and love your explorations. My personal goals of posting in Wildlife are to create an image that is most realistic. That is where I have trouble. So this forum has members with a variety of interests and I think it is fair to ask how do you want a particular image to be commented upon. Although soon we will know what you want by the type of image you post.
For your image above I really feel the power of this lion with the emphasis you put on eyes and face, allowing the bkgd to very minimal in color and detail. The darkness of the mane & ears frame the face nicely and direct the viewer straight to those intense eyes. Good to catch the leg in motion, also adding support to the fearlessness of this lion as he is continuing to walk straight to you, and does not turn away. Tiny point, I would lower the saturation of that darker green area on the left edge of the image. It does draw some attention.
Well, Andreas, personally I don't think you've pushed this too far at all. I like it - as Gabriela said - would make a lovely print. I would reduce colour even more, make it more B&W/sepia by tweaking saturation down (especially the hint of green in the BG). I would also dodge the face some more, and perhaps (as with my suggestion in the last one) reduce overall contrast just a little (10% down?).
Andreas, I really like this shot. With so many great photographers posting here it is refreshing and stimulating to see a different approach.
For me though it is not so much a study in wildlife as a step towards creating a distinctive style of your own.
As has been said, it is hard to critique this as a lion photo. It is much closer to a piece of photographic art, and, as such, will attract much more subjective reactions.
It doesn't bother me which forum you post imags like this in as long as you keep posting them.
Thanks Morkel and Nancy for the support and glad you like it in general. There is always room for making this better or different or both. I never think about an image that i post here is the final thing, simply because i get ideas and suggestions from others who give a direction for improvement.Even there are sometimes only small things.
As you all should know my "normal" postings are far more in numbers , so i also like to post the natural looking images far more, but from time to time i like to be creative/provocative for others and more important for myself, major reason to post this kind of images.
I do not understand your question, same as Steve, about what i am asking for . If i want to know your opinion about a specific thing like processing/design/contrast/ etc, i would ask for that in the intro.
If i ask in general like WDYT? i am asking for a general opinion of all of you about the image in total, all what it stands for as posted.. Like the conversion/colors/contrast/tonal range etc, for sure i am not asking something like "does it look natural", because it does not.
But it should be clear for every viewer that this cannot look natural,and it is for sure not the goal to look natural.I see it as a artful interpretation of what i captured originally .
In the old days we had different films to achieve this in combination with the darkroom techniques like "Bleach Bypass". In this technique there is no bleaching in the chemical process of a color film , it is skipped Morkel. So you end up with an image where you have basically HL and SH and almost no MT.The Sh are plugged and the HL are burned.
I could write a lot more , but that goes too far. All i hope is that all of you guys accept the way i , or others do this kind of thing .When i saw the first images of Peter D, posted in here , in a somewhat unusual/extreme way, i also thought ………….mmmhh, what is this good for? But i changed my mind somehow.
Reason for not posting this in OOTB is , i did nothing but tonal changes , somebody else called this in another context " Contrast on Steroids" or" D&B on Steroids".I have added nothing or removed anything in a conventional way , just used what is already in the image .
A suggestion from my side to the mods would be, to make it easier for some folks here,maybe there are voices asking what the **** are doing this kind of images here, why not create a Subforum for this sort of stuff……….? Specially in the wildlife forum, because some of us like to experiment .
Hi Andreas, the head on pose lends itself to the format, no question and I like the space ratio between top & bottom. The raised paw adds to the image, but I would like to see more tonal content in that leg to balance the rest of the subject. The colour tones work nicely, but like the treatment nothing we haven't seen before (i.e. Chas). Having a minimal BKG also works well, as it isolates the subject and ensures the eyes are not drawn away by distracting objects. Did you clone out and debris, i.e. grass, stones etc? This approach certainly lends itself to a canvas print, as the texture would dovetail with the technique.
I would disagree that this 'treatment' could become your 'style/fingerprint' or even being creative, as it is only an adjustment which we can all apply, it needs to be taken further and beyond, just applying it doesn't start to become a unique 'trademark/style'. Andreas I'm not trying to be hard here, i just want folks to understand that being creative or have a distinctive style takes a lot more input i.e. Nick Brandt. I think if you want to develop this you need to take it, then put your 'own' spin on it, as it stand it's a 6 out of 10, however other areas need to looked at with 'how you shoot it, the styling, framing, composition, close-up, wide angle etc' and so you begin to build up a series of images, with their own distinctive character. Then you begin to elevated the image, going the full 9 yards, then IMHO do you start getting close to creating a 'look & feel' of your own.
TFS
Steve
Post Production: It’s ALL about what you do with the tools and not, which brand of tool you use.
Hi Andreas - I like this one. I've looked at it a few times and would love to see a version without the green of the grass in the middle behind the lion, just leaving the tufts of grass near the feet. If you don't like that suggestion at least deal with the blob on the left edge.
Those eyes can definitely bore a hole into one's soul. I agree this would like nice as a print or canvas.
Hello Neil , Steve and Rachel thanks for your feedback and input always good to hear or read your thoughts.
Rachel you could be right by reducing the greens in the back, will try that .
Steve as i said somewhere in this thread, nothing removed or added besides the canvas extension on top. All is done by tonal tweaks and D&B and masking.
What i do not understand in your reply is your disagreement on what ? Who stated that this is my style ? Or become a style ? Or even is a style ? Me , not? If you think this is not creative , ok your point.
If you think this is a 6 out of 10 . i am fine with it, never even thought about a judgement like this.I will never get to people you are referring to, from their skills POV, (photographically and PP) just simply because i do this for fun , not for business. So i think it is not fair to compare my treatments , that YOU all could have applied , with people like Nick Brandt or some other great photographers.And who said that you cannot do this ? Me , not!But who is doing it here ? I do not see many of them here ? Why ? i do not know , and actually i do not care. I do my own thing , like i want to do.
I am really interested in your intension to write what you have written. On one hand you comment good to see people exploring and breaking rules and then you just smack them , by your words. I would have fully understand if , in this case, i have ever stated this is great stuff , or i am close to or on the way to be like Nick
Brandt. But this is or was never the case. I feel you are comparing a shot taken with 10D and a 1Dx , or an 79er VW Beetle with a BMW 2014 , i personally think the beetle has got more personality,so just asking is this fair ?
I think about myself , doesn`t matter what you think , that i am playing around and get results that pleases me more or less.
As a consequence out of this , i must review my thoughts about………………………. whatever .
Andreas, I think perhaps this is where translation/language may come into play. Part of my reply was more towards a comment left by Martin, which I felt I needed to addressed in some way to perhaps clarify my thoughts on what is deemed as 'style'. Right or wrong I'm trying to think about the 'bigger picture' and areas that need to be thought about if we talk about 'distinctive style', obviously others are welcome to chime in with their own thoughts too.
Again, this is where I feel 'conversation' comes more into play and a discussion is had, rather than exchanges of 'typing' which can be cold and maybe misinterpreted. Exchanges in a discussion as you know, easily clarifies thoughts, expressions and views and where we can easily see both POVs and understand where each other is coming from.
This is going away from the original approach and what I think, you are looking for, however it is something that we may at times need to think about, but this is early days and we should not get bogged down by things like this, it's getting back to the initial idea of 'exploring', albeit working within some perimeters, before it ventures into the orbit of OOTB.
Cheers
Steve
Post Production: It’s ALL about what you do with the tools and not, which brand of tool you use.
Steve - you could have avoided this by referring straight to Martin`s comment.
Translation /language could be addressed by you , by talking more simply for a German.
I do think in `smaller picture`, just my own narrow mind.
It is now going or went into a direction i actually cannot follow, by my narrow mind and language.
I need to over think my habit here an stop this now ……………….
Thanks again for your `bigger picture `thoughts i cannot follow .
I'm not a huge fan of High Key images in general Andreas, but I do like the determination in the walk, the battle scared face and eye contact here.
I do applaud the effort and direction you went with this.
It is quite amazing, the power of the word and the communication we have here on BPN. It often brings a sense of identity, of community. While in terms of technical comments we all speak the same words, when it comes to aesthetic interpretation the language has many layers and some of us tend to get lost in ambiguities...So I have a humble suggestion to make, and that is: let us ask "what did you mean by that" when not sure of the intention behind the text we're reading...I too encounter at times "thoughts I can not follow", but my experience with various languages and translation taught me to clarify things and avoid misinterpretation - and here I agree with Steve that "conversation" is the way to go :)Wishing you all a wonderful fun week-end,
Hello all, after last night frustration about a thread of different opinions /misunderstanding etc, i woke up and thought well, take it as is and keep smiling . It is not that important to make you feel grumpy about yourself and others.
Conversation is good and asking even better.
I got lost in translation and maybe misunderstanding, who knows .I know what i think about that , but too difficult in this context. Cannot really follow ,when it goes into depth /personality /emotions etc, disadvantage compared to people where English is their language and not a trained one .
In the future i try to avoid this , makes life easier.
Things can happen…………. and we are all different, with different personalities and feelings . Ok here we go.
Regarding the image …….. people from Google saw this and they offered me to take this `Style `as a preset for the next update of Color Efex Pro , LOL.
I love the high key treatment indeed. Going by the eyes only, this looks to me as if it needs a bit of CW rotation....
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Food for thoughts with a KTP Lion
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. This lion - the way the image is processed - would make a lovely print, in my opinion. Very contrasty and striking. I would love to see a B/W version of this, I believe you had a relatively sharp image to begin with (despite the 1/200s) and nice detail where it counts. I really like that slight movement blur on the front paw, the expression on the lion's face, and the point of view - would love to see a new version of this sometime, something more "Peter Delaney" style, something sketchy, hi key, what do you think? 
,so just asking is this fair ?
