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When shooting on a tripod which I.S. mode should you be using? In particular I am interested on the current 300/2.8. I read somewhere a long time ago that mode 2 is the one and that is what I having been using (to good effect) but I cannot find any articles relating to this.
41 views and no one knows the answer - I am amazed :2
You can keep the IS on for this lens when on a tripod. Mode 2 is simply for panning situations.
**Any IS lens with the first generation IS technology should be turned OFF when on a tripod.**
Daniel,Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Cadieux
Mode 2 is the mode that should be used all the time. There is never an advantage to using mode 1. The only difference between mode 1 and mode 2 is that mode 2 will turn off horizontal IS when a panning motion is detected. In non panning situations, mode 1 and mode 2 will behave the same, so unless you never pan, mode 2 is the way to go. Even if you never pan mode 1 has no advantage over mode 2.
Either mode will turn off IS when the lens is stationary (on a tripod).
Thank you Daniel, I know you can keep the I.S. on when on a tripod but cannot find any reference on Canon sites as to which mode - you are saying it should be mode 1 !!!.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Cadieux
I must admit that I get better results by using mode 2 on a tripod and mode 1 for hand held stuff.
Thank you Jim. According to what I have read there is a definite advantage to be had by leaving I.S. on when using a tripod - helps with mirror slap and tripod bounces but surely if it just switched the I.S. off then it would be no advantage :2Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Neiger
Roy,Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy Churchill
Lack of motion deactivates the IS. Vibration due to wind or mirror slap would be motion that causes the IS to activate. That is one reason why I suggest always leaving IS ON and in mode 2. Leaving IS ON and in mode 2 covers every situation and the only disadvantage is wear on the IS components. Some photogs say that IS slows down AF, but I've never noticed a difference, and I've tried it both ways comparing them.
May be of interest:
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consum...s_Advantage_IS
FYI, I just leave my 300 f/2.8 on mode 1, and on all the time except when doing long exposures on a tripod (longer than about 1/5 second). I've never had an issue when panning. Same with my 500 f/4.
Roger
Looks like there is no absolute answer to this. Of the three that have commented so far, Roger uses mode1 just about all of the time while Jim uses mode 2 all the time and Daniel switches between the two.
For birds in flight (handheld) some folks will switch I.S. off and others will use mode 2. I used to switch it off but recently I have been using mode 1 and getting quite good results.
Anyone else got any comments on this subject ?
Roger,Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Clark
The info you linked indicated there may be a problem caused by the IS when panning in mode 1. That is why they have mode 2. I can't see any advantage to using mode 1 over mode 2, but there does appear to be an advantage for mode 2 over mode 1 when panning. My question for you, is why do you use mode 1 all of the time?
When you are shooting with high shutter speed (1/500s or faster), you do not need any IS/VR on at all. I assume that would be 99% of the cases when you're shooting BIF. Having said that, it does not mean you cannot leave the IS on if you choose to and with the right mode.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy Churchill
It gets muddier: tests I've done confirm that with the Canon 500/4 locked down on a tripod with IS on, the IS does not detect this situation and turn off.
Newer Canon IS lenses have a "tripod detect" mode and will automatically switch to the mode when it senses a lack of motion. Here is a relatively recent list of IS lenses and their IS status per Chuck Westfall:
The following EF Image Stabilizer lenses support "Tripod IS":
EF28-300mm f/3.5-5.6L IS USM
EF70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM
EF70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM
EF300mm f/2.8L IS USM
EF400mm f/2.8L IS USM
EF400mm f/4 DO IS USM
EF500mm f/4L IS USM
EF600mm f/4L IS USM
The following EF Image Stabilizer lenses do not support "Tripod IS":
EF28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM
EF75-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
EF100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM
EF300mm f/4L IS USM
Recent IS lenses from Canon are not listed, but this feature has been added to all Canon IS lenses since about 2000.
Here is what Chuck Westfall says about lenses without Tripod IS:
"The IS mechanism operates by correcting shake. When there is no shake, or when the level of shake is below the threshold of the system's detection capability, use of the IS feature may actually *add* unwanted blur to the photograph, therefore you should shut it off in this situation. Remember that the IS lens group is normally locked into place. When the IS function is active, the IS lens group is unlocked so it can be moved by the electromagnetic coil surrounding the elements. When there's not enough motion for the IS system to detect, the result can sometimes be a sort of electronic 'feedback loop,' somewhat analogous to the ringing noise of an audio feedback loop we're all familiar with. As a result, the IS lens group might move while the lens is on a tripod, unless the IS function is switched off and the IS lens group is locked into place."
The long answer on how this works can be found on this thread at the Luminous Landscape, about halfway down the page. Here is a quote on how Tripod IS works on lenses since 2000:
"Based on my own personal testing and
observation, as well as a personal consultation with one of Canon
Inc.'s chief executives in the Lens Division, these lenses effectively
have 2 IS modes *within Mode 1.* The decision on which mode will be
used is made by the equipment, not the photographer, based on an
evaluation of the degree of detected movement, as follows:
A. When the lens is mounted on a steady tripod and the shutter button
is pressed halfway, the IS begins to operate immediately and the image
in the viewfinder goes through a very slow vertical shift for about 1
second. After that, if the shutter button continues to be pressed
halfway, the IS mechanism automatically goes into a special mode which
is designed to detect and correct for mirror slap and shutter movement
at slow shutter speeds. Based on my personal testing, it does this job
spectacularly well. Close examination of results from shooting tests
definitively proves that there is no advantage to be gained by
shutting off IS, or even by locking the mirror prior to exposure.
B. When the lens is mounted on a monopod or hand-held *and* the gyro
sensors detect movement exceeding a certain rate, the IS mechanism
switches into its conventional correction mode which is designed to
compensate for relatively gross and/or erratic lens movement.
So, what you're seeing when you loosen the ball head and start moving
the lens is essentially an automatic switchover from "tripod IS" to
"conventional IS."
If you set a newer lens to Mode 2, you'll never get the advantages of Tripod IS mode.
Jeff- That is the theory. However, in practice it doesn't seem to work and it's not just my 500/4. There is an old BPN thread on this somewhere.
Try it for yourself. Lock the lens/camera down on a good rock-solid tripod, indoors to avoid and wind vibration. Put on Live View and with a cable release (so as you don't vibrate the lens), half press the button. With IS on, mode 1 or 2, you will see the tell-tale creep of the image across the screen as the IS tries to correct and creates a feedback loop. Release the shutter button and the image will jump back to the neutral position.
Chuck Westfall's statement does not refer to using Live View. Tripod IS mode is designed to correct for mirror slap and that would be hard to do in Live View. I rarely use Live View in the field and find that under real world conditions Tripod IS mode works as Chuck Westfall states, with my lenses that have this feature
Jeff- All Live View does is let you see the image drift caused by the IS being on. If IS really turned off automatically when a tripod is detected, this image drift would not occur when you pressed the shutter halfway.
My newer lenses behave as Chuck Westfall states in point A above. The image stabilizes after about 1 second, as observed through the viewfinder. I'll try your experiment using Live View tomorrow and see what happens.
My experience with my lenses (newer IS): 500 f/4 and 300 f/2.8 (not the newest versions):
On a tripod, one can look through the viewfinder and see the drift that John talks about, I would say it is longer than a second, more like 2 or 3 seconds.
Regarding Jim's question of why mode 1 and not mode 2: I photograph a lot of subjects while still and then move. For example, a bird at rest then takes off. While I'm on the still subject, I want IS on both axes. When panning, I have never, not once, had a problem with mode 1 IS.
At high magnification (e.g. 500 mm and higher) even a big carbon fiber tripod is not real steady. There are always small vibrations of several pixels whenever one is touching the camera. One can verify this by turning on live view and 10x magnification and viewing the image with and without the stabilizer on. So IS on for all but the very longest exposures is important in my experience. For long exposures, or some relatively static subjects, I'll turn IS off and lock up the mirror. E.g., I'll photograph the Moon this way (typically 1/100 second or so with stacked TCs so 1400 mm or longer).
I have had situations where the IS did not help with mirror slap. For example, at 1000 mm (500+2x) on a safari vehicle with the wimberly mounted on top: 1/10 second exposure and mirror slap even with IS on still ruined the image. I did mirror lock-up, IS on and got nice images. My hands on the camera as the subject was moving around a little, as well as the vehicle slightly rocking.
Regarding fast shutter speeds not needing IS, that is true, but IS also steadies the image so helps provide smoother AF tracking by steadying the image that the AF sensors are measuring. So IS on regardless of shutter speed is important in my experience and improves AF tracking accuracy. Test this yourself by recording video of a subject while panning (subject at constant distance) with IS on and with IS off. Which image is more stable? If you are like me, it is the one with IS on, at least for telephoto focal lengths.
But there is one lens in my experience where IS should be turned off at high shutter speeds: the 300 f/4 L IS. Even hand holding or panning, the image quality drops at shutter speeds around 1/3000 second or faster. At least this is the case with my 300. I noticed this problem many years ago and ran some tests to show the effect. Those images are around somewhere....
Roger
My 500/f4 IS is about one-year old and the IS comes on, even when it's on a solid tripod. When I do moon shots, I see it come on and actually shake the image briefly while it gets up to speed and stabilizes. That's a case, depending on you SS, that you might want it off. I'll typically leave it on, use live view to get the mirror up, push my remote release half-way down, wait a second and the take the shot. Turning the IS off would be as easy, but it doesn't matter so long as you're aware of what's going on.
For static birds, I tend to keep the IS spinning while waiting for the eyelight and best head position, etc. and the squeeze the shutter home at the appropriate moments. I shoot most BIF hand-held, but when on the tripod I keep the shutter speed up, as if hand-held, and bump the AF occasionally to keep focus and keep the IS primed.
IS def OFF on tripod...I can see the image "floating" in the finder when IS is ON and on a tripod... don't do it or you will get blurry images
I am not sure this Westfall guy actually knows anything...what IS tripod mode? It is not even in my lenses' manual, please show me an official document from Canon on Canon website...
Dan
It is not the same on all lenses.
http://www.dlcphotography.net/TripodAndIS.htm
and yes you can take Chuck for his word........
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/chuck-westfall/0/894/a20
Bill
Bill,Quote:
Originally Posted by William Malacarne
Do you have something on official CANON website that indicates the IS is turned off for 500 and 300 lenses? I am not talking about blogs, sketchy sites etc...
Chuck who might be a technical adviser for Canon, they have several thousand other employees too, just like any government employee can say something, unless officially confirmed it is just word of mouth...I remember back in 2008 someone quoted from this chuck dude denying any AF problems with the MKIII, two days later they issued a recall.
Here is Canon's take on IS
http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consum...s_Advantage_IS
http://web.canon.jp/imaging/lens/technology/index3.html
maybe I have missed it but can you show me where it states the IS is turned off on tripod for these lenses? How does the system distinguish between a tripod and steady hands? Does that mean that if I hold my lens super steady it is going to turn the IS off because it thinks I am on a tripod? What about a monopod?
For sure my lenses do not turn IS off on gitzo and side kick....maybe they are defective...
I'd guess if you can really, really, absolutely really :S3: hold a lens as steady as when it's on a tripod, the IS would be off. But, I doubt anyone can do that. And so the system can be set to tell if the lens is being hand-held or is on really, truly stable ground.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Avelon
You def can hold for example a Canon 24-105 IS lens rock steady...any ways, all of this is pointless...unless someone can show something from Canon (not our friend Chuck or uncle Fred's forum) that specifically states the IS will shut off on tripod...I am really interested because none of my lenses do that and then I will have to send them for service :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Desmond Chan
It is a simple google search:Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Avelon
image stabilization off on tripod site:canon.com
turns up:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...&aqi=&aql=&oq=
which says:
"Automatic tripod detection and malfunction prevention
The EF70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM incorporates the same automatic tripod detection function that is used with Canon’s super-telephoto IS lenses. Output signals from the vibration gyro are analyzed to determine if the lens is hand-held or mounted on a tripod. When the image stabilizer function is turned on and the lens detects that a tripod is in use, the shift lens is electronically centered and locked on the optical axis, preventing improper operation."
Roger
LOL...you're funny Dan :bg3::bg3::t3Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Avelon
Roger I am not sure....that doesn't quite say the IS is turned off. It appears that it operates in a different way...Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Clark
Also on the same google page
http://www.canon.com/camera-museum/t...05/200805.html
<table class="text" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="0"><tbody><tr><td align="center" valign="top"> </td> <td>Image stabilization when using a monopod is equivalent to hand-held image stabilization</td> </tr> <tr> <td align="center" valign="top"> · </td> <td>Image stabilization available when using a tripod**</td> </tr> <tr> <td align="center" valign="top"> · </td> <td>Image stabilization can be used with the EF 1.4x II or EF 2x II extender attached</td> </tr> </tbody></table>
*The minimum unaided hand-held shutter speed is roughly [1/focal length] seconds.
**In certain shooting conditions and with certain tripod types, it is better to work with image stabilization off.
So first of all it doesn't say IS is turned off, it says "IS available" which actually means IS operates. Secondly it recommends to turn it off in "certain" conditions....which is what everybody is recommending. :w3
So are you Desmond, just curious...are you a photographer?...do you shoot with Canon? how much experience do you have with Canon telephotos and IS?Quote:
Originally Posted by Desmond Chan
You the MAN, Dan :bg3::t3:5Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Avelon
It's easy enough to find out which is superior with your own lenses but putting the camera and lens on your tripod and seeing what happens. For me, with my 500/f4, I leave it on, but make certain that it's spooled up before I release the shutter. That works for still, static shots and when panning for BIF, for instance.
I tried your experiment using Live View with these bodies:Quote:
Originally Posted by John Chardine
Canon 7D
Canon 50D
Canon 60D
Canon 1D Mklln
Canon T1i
I used a handful of lenses including 300mm f/2.8 IS, 28~135mm IS, 300mm f/4 IS, 70~200mm f/2.8 IS ll and found a considerable difference in the performance that varies with the body and lens combination.
The 7D provided the best results with the70~200mm IS stabilizing in about 1 second when on a sturdy Gitzo tripod and Arca Swiss ball head. The 300mm f/2.8 also had very good performance on the 7D and 1D Mklln. The worst was the T1i and the 28~135mm. That combination never seemed to settle down.
I've read that battery condition affects IS and I performed the tests with fully charged batteries and using the Canon Vertical Grips. I'll test again shortly when I've run down the batteries to 50% charge or lower.
Originally Posted by Dan Avelon
You def can hold for example a Canon 24-105 IS lens rock steady..
LOL...you're funny Dan
To a point, unless the lens is placed atop the rock, wink.
--------------------------
I have never, ever, heard IS go off when shooting atop a tripod with any lens I have owned. Perhaps, the whirring sound still occurs and IS disengages, but it does not appear to do so when looking through either viewfinder or LCD.
Chas
Here you have EF LENS WORK III that shows all that you need to know about the amazing lens.
In page 186 and 187 you can read all about IS. I am going to use MODE 2 from now on tripod because it does all that MODE 1 does but can detect panning.
http://software.canon-europe.com/fil..._Book_9_EN.pdf
To read all about the lens look att this link
http://www.canon-europe.com/Support/...ork_iii_en.asp
Image Stabilizer systemThe Image Stabilizer operates as follows.aWhen the camera’s shutter button is pushed down half
way, the lock on the stabilizer optical system is released and
at the same time the vibration gyro starts up.
bThe vibration gyro detects the angular velocity component
of the lens vibration caused by hand-shake, and transmits a
detection signal to the microcomputer.
cThe detection signal is converted to a stabilizer optical
system drive signal by the microcomputer, which then
transmits this signal to the stabilizer optical system drive
circuit.
dThe stabilizer optical system actuator moves the system in
parallel in response to the drive signal.
eThe drive status of the stabilizer optical system is
converted into a detection signal by the location sensor and
detection circuit both installed on the Image Stabilizer unit,
and this signal is then transmitted to the microcomputer.
fThe microcomputer compares the drive signal referred to
in 3 with the detection signal referred to in 5 and performs
feedback control, thus increasing the controllability of the
stabilizer optical system. This microcomputer, the first high
speed 16-bit type in an EF lens, can simultaneously control
image stabilization, USM, and EMD. (Figure-56)
WImage Stabilizer Mode 2
The stabilization characteristics of the Image Stabilizeractivating the image stabilizer.
described above are set so that it is most effective when
photographing stationary subjects, but when panning of a
moving subject is attempted, shake-return may affect the
finder image, interfering with framing. This occurs because
camera movement such as panning is judged to be shaking,
To resolve this problem, Canon developed Image Stabilizer
Mode 2. In this mode, if large movement such as panning
continues for a preset time, image stabilization in the
direction of the motion is shut off. As this stabilizes the finder
image during movement, accurate framing is possible. In
Image Stabilizer Mode 2, if you are panning, image
stabilization continues vertically relative to the movement of
the camera, making it possible to control vertical shaking
during panning. (Figure-55)
Image Stabilizer Mode 2 was introduced for the first time on
the EF 300mm f/4L IS USM. It has since been mounted on
other lenses, mainly telephoto/tele-zoom lenses.WTripod-compatible Image Stabilizer
When the first IS lenses were used with a tripod, the image
stabilizer malfunctioned, requiring the photographer to turn
off the image stabilizer function. However, the EF 300mm
f/2.8L IS USM and other new models in the super telephoto L
type IS series are equipped with an image stabilizer that can
be used with a tripod, which prevents malfunctioning. Since
the system uses a vibration gyro to automatically detect when
the camera is mounted on a tripod, the photographer can
focus on the photograph without having to think about
turning the stabilizer on and off. And when a monopod is
used with any lens in the IS series, image stabilization is
identical to that achieved during hand-held photography.WEffect of Image Stabilization
The image stabilization function for EF lenses was first usedfor use in even more lenses in the future.
on the EF 75-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM in 1995. Converted into
shutter speed, the effect of image stabilization equals about
two steps. With a 300mm telephoto lens, it permits hand-held
photography at l/60 second. Later, through improvements to
the design of the image stabilizer unit and the algorithm used,
the performance of the effect was raised even further, to three
steps, with the EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM which went on
sale in 2001, and to 4 steps with the EF 70-200mm f/4L IS
USM which went on sale in 2006. The lower limit on handheld
photography at slow shutter speeds was thus reduced
significantly.
When the Image Stabilizer Mode 2 is on and an extender is
installed, it provides equivalent image stabilization effects. The
image stabilizer function is also effective during close-up
photography and photography in unstable places. The Image
Stabilizer function that brings photographers these many
benefits will be installed on many more EF lenses as a
standard EF lens technology, evolving even further
