Canon 300mm f4L IS with Canon 2x teleconverter?

My dilemma: Should I get a 2x teleconverter to use with this lens (I know it would be manual focus only and 2 stops light loss) on a tripod to extend my focal reach for birds farther away or get the 400mm f5.6L + my 1.4x teleconverter? I am concerned about losing image quality with the 2x tele. I really enjoy bird photography but won't be purchasing the 500mm lens anytime soon-the 400mm lens is as far as I can go. Should I just work on my technique with the 300? I really do love this lens.

Thanks!

Hi Julie Big Warm Welcome !!!!!

Would suggest going with the 400 5.6 It is one sharp lens and with corp factor cameras even better. The lens is sharp with a 1.4X converter but with care you will be able to use it straight by learning to close in on the birds !!! Looking forward to your images !!!

... btw when I had the 300 f 4.0 used it mostly for flowers and macro !!!

I have used the 300/4L IS for over three years mostly with the 1.4x and sometimes the 2x. The 1.4x is brilliant (Canon brand of course). The 2x does degrade IQ a bit, but in good light it is quite usable as a 600/8 MF lens. I have tried the 400/5.6 with 1.4x and taped pins so AF is possible, though hunts quite a bit and I did not like it much. I also prefer to have IS over the 400/1.4x combo. The 300mm and 1.4x/2x will serve me well until such time I can get a super tele. :) With the 2x, it's best to use some sort of support like a bean bag or preferably tripod. Also, either way, get as close as possible to the subject with both converters. Don't let the focal length let you fall into a false sense of security. :) Of course, if you can, try both lenses first. As Al said, the 300 is also a great macro especially with a tube or two.

Here is a link to the 2x combo

http://amatteroflight.com/gallery2/d...-Kite_2266.jpg

and another one with stacked converters (I think it's not bad)

http://amatteroflight.com/gallery2/d...uckoo_5227.jpg

The below image was captured with a 300mm f/4L and stacked 1.4x and 2x converters, about 80% full frame. Yes, IQ is noticeable, but IMHO it is more than a usable image.

http://amatteroflight.com/gallery2/d...-male_5515.jpg

Good to know that the 400mm f5.6L will pair well with my 40D. After thinking about the options I am leaning toward putting the $300 cost of the 2x tele toward this lens. I have attached a sample image using the 300mm f4L IS hand-held. It is also a super lens for photographing butterflies-I have had a lot of fun with it.:)
Thanks so much for the advice.

Thanks for the link Akos. These images make your argument for stacking teleconverters very convincing. Were they shot from a tripod?

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Originally Posted by Julie Brown

Thanks for the link Akos. These images make your argument for stacking teleconverters very convincing. Were they shot from a tripod?

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Both the juvenile kite portrait and the cuckoo head/shoulders shot were from my car, only using the passenger seat or window sill as support. So more or less hand held. I am not trying to say it's a better choice than a 400/5.6, as I used that without a TC in GOOD light and it is an awesome little lens for birds in flight. But for me that is about as much as I used it for. If it had IS it would be a no brainer. I doubt Canon will put IS into that lens though.

Good luck with whichever choice you make. Please let us know how you are getting on. :)

Thanks again for the info Akos. Now I think I might get both! You definitely need good light, I know that. I still want to get some decent images even if I can't get close. The 300 has an IS setting for BIF as well, but my previous efforts are poor and I need a lot more practice! I will keep you posted as to what I purchase. I'm going to Lake Erie in May for a major warbler migration here in the US and need to know how to get the best out of my equipment.

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Originally Posted by Julie Brown

Thanks again for the info Akos. Now I think I might get both! You definitely need good light, I know that. I still want to get some decent images even if I can't get close. The 300 has an IS setting for BIF as well, but my previous efforts are poor and I need a lot more practice! I will keep you posted as to what I purchase. I'm going to Lake Erie in May for a major warbler migration here in the US and need to know how to get the best out of my equipment.

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Warbler? You'll need an 800mm. :(

That shows my ignorance. I guess I won't be getting any warbler images. I will just have to look for the bigger birds. This will be my first time visiting this particular wildlife refuge. They are having a bird festival around this migration.
So, will I need a spotting scope to have any chance of seeing these birds? What about stacking teleconverters with my 300 f4? Or maybe I could rent a lens for the weekend. The biggest lens I could get at our local camera store is the 500mm f4L IS. Maybe that lens with the 1.4x teleconverter and still keep AF?
Thanks for your reply Akos.

I am sure you could nail some even at 420mm if you can stalk or use a hide, just harder, much, much harder to get a good shot.

Rent the 500!!!! It's an awesome lens. I've used one a few times and it blows me away! You'll love it Julie. :cool:

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Originally Posted by Julie Brown

That shows my ignorance. I guess I won't be getting any warbler images. I will just have to look for the bigger birds. This will be my first time visiting this particular wildlife refuge. They are having a bird festival around this migration.
So, will I need a spotting scope to have any chance of seeing these birds? What about stacking teleconverters with my 300 f4? Or maybe I could rent a lens for the weekend. The biggest lens I could get at our local camera store is the 500mm f4L IS. Maybe that lens with the 1.4x teleconverter and still keep AF?
Thanks for your reply Akos.

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I've been to Crane Creek/Magee Marsh and Point Pelee many times for warblers. Depending on weather conditions, many times you can walk up to the birds. In Point Pelee I've picked warblers off the beach that were too exhausted to fly any further. You should be fine with anything in the 300mm to 400mm range.

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Originally Posted by Jeff Donald

I've been to Crane Creek/Magee Marsh and Point Pelee many times for warblers. Depending on weather conditions, many times you can walk up to the birds. In Point Pelee I've picked warblers off the beach that were too exhausted to fly any further. You should be fine with anything in the 300mm to 400mm range.

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Hi Jeff

All sounds good. Without knowing the migration (it sounds like a convergence point) route and stages, I would suggest though - primarily for the welfare of the exhausted birds - to not get that close for the sake of the image itself with a shorter FL lens. I know it sounds tempting and easy. I guess I just prefer to err on the side of caution and leave the birds be and conserve strength and gather their energies for further travel (unless they are grounded, then get them to a wildlife care facility; if one exists locally). :)

I am suggesting from the other side of the world without actually knowing how it all is at those locations, however, I would always think of the birds' welfare (as I am sure you would too).
Respectfully yours.
Ákos

Hi Akos,

The Park I'm referring to is Pt. Pelee National Park of Canada It's well know in the Western Hemisphere as a migration corridor over Lake Erie. The migrating birds, at times, need to be rescued from the beach so that the waves don't wash them into the lake and they drown. The park has limited access and the nearest wildlife care facility would be hours away. Immediate action is required to save the birds when conditions change. Temperatures can change 20° in a matter of minutes and birds literally fall out of trees. I'm not really thinking about taking pictures, but rather attempting to save the birds from being predated.

I agree that distance should be kept from birds as a safety factor. However, the park maintains numerous paths through the park and just walking along the paths you'l encounter birds just a few feet off the path. This has been going on for decades and I can't see where the birds have been harmed by their close encounters. They have much more important things on their minds like not being eaten by a Coop or a Sharpie.

Hi Jeff,
Thanks for the info about Crane Creek/Magee Marsh. I am really looking forward to going there. I just started a subscription to Wildbird Magazine and read the article about bird festivals. Your experiences at Pt. Pelee NP sound really interesting. I hope to learn a lot more about the warbler migration when I go the festival in May. I don't think I have ever personally seen a warbler before (novice birder) and would be thrilled to get a few decent images

Hi Akos,
yes, I think renting is the way to go here. I'm sure I will love the 500mm f4L IS and then I will want it, but I don't think I will be selling my car to buy it. Bird Photography is addicting! Next I will be signing up for one of Art Morris's workshops.:) I am going to try stacking teleconverters before I buy the 400mm f5.6L. If I get decent results I will post them in the Eager to Learn Forum. This discourse has really helped me think all of this through.
:cool:Thank you