The future of Compact Flash

In doing a little research, I ran across this info about compact flash:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CompactFlash

and in particular, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CompactFlash#CFast

"CFast
A future version of CompactFlash, known as CFast, will be based on the Serial ATA bus, rather than the Parallel ATA/IDE bus for which all previous versions of CompactFlash are designed."

"These cards will support a higher maximum transfer rate than current CompactFlash cards. As of 2009[update], SATA supports transfer rates up to 300 MB/s, while PATA is limited to 133 MB/s using UDMA 6. Few, if any, current flash memory device support speeds greater than 133 MB/s, and CFast cards will not be physically or electronically compatible with CF cards, requiring new card readers and new digital cameras to take advantage of them. CFast cards use a 7-pin SATA data connector (identical to the standard SATA connector), but a 17-pin power connector that appears incompatible with the standard 15-pin SATA power connector,[9] so an adaptor will be required to connect CFast cards in place of standard SATA hard drives."

"CFast cards are expected to reach market in late 2009.[10] At CES 2009, Pretec showed a 32 GiB CFast and announced that they should reach market within a few months.[11]"

So, has anyone heard of CFast? I have mixed feelings. I have over 120 GBytesof CF and don't relish having to buy new cards. But on the other hand, memory keeps getting cheaper so hopefully the new CFast will be lower cost. I've seen predictions of about $1 per gigabyte in the not too distant future.

Roger

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Originally Posted by rnclark

In doing a little research, I ran across this info about compact flash:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CompactFlash

and in particular, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CompactFlash#CFast

"CFast
A future version of CompactFlash, known as CFast, will be based on the Serial ATA bus, rather than the Parallel ATA/IDE bus for which all previous versions of CompactFlash are designed."

"These cards will support a higher maximum transfer rate than current CompactFlash cards. As of 2009[update], SATA supports transfer rates up to 300 MB/s, while PATA is limited to 133 MB/s using UDMA 6. Few, if any, current flash memory device support speeds greater than 133 MB/s, and CFast cards will not be physically or electronically compatible with CF cards, requiring new card readers and new digital cameras to take advantage of them. CFast cards use a 7-pin SATA data connector (identical to the standard SATA connector), but a 17-pin power connector that appears incompatible with the standard 15-pin SATA power connector,[9] so an adaptor will be required to connect CFast cards in place of standard SATA hard drives."

"CFast cards are expected to reach market in late 2009.[10] At CES 2009, Pretec showed a 32 GiB CFast and announced that they should reach market within a few months.[11]"

So, has anyone heard of CFast? I have mixed feelings. I have over 120 GBytesof CF and don't relish having to buy new cards. But on the other hand, memory keeps getting cheaper so hopefully the new CFast will be lower cost. I've seen predictions of about $1 per gigabyte in the not too distant future.

Roger

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Hi Roger,
Yes I have seen prototypes, actually current MLC NAND FLASH price is 1$/GB already! (This was Dec 2008).

If the current cameras are based on PATA, to use SATA will be it hardware or software that needs to be changed?

If PATA = 133/mbs; how come the current "best" SanDisk are 45/mbs?

Replacing cards doesn't bother me nearly as much as having to carry incompatible cards does. If I have one CFast body and one CF body on me, I have to pay more attention to what cards I'm grabbing when I change cards. To me that's undesirable. But that has more to do with how the manufactuers handle the transition than the cards.

Then again it still bothers me to no end that I can't use an LP-E4 in a grip on Canon's lower tier bodies.

Jay

I don't think the 133 is actually mbs it is just a rating. Look at this chart that was on the link that roger sent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CompactFlash#Speed

Bill

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Originally Posted by Jay Gould

If the current cameras are based on PATA, to use SATA will be it hardware or software that needs to be changed?

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Possibly both. But it really depends on how the cameras are designed and implemented at the component level.

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If PATA = 133/mbs; how come the current "best" SanDisk are 45/mbs?

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The bus speed is like a speed limit. You can move data no faster than that, but there's nothing to stop you from moving data slower than it. In the case of compact flash cards, they don't have fast enough memory cells, or enough memory cells in parallel to move data at the full speed the bus can handle.

I am not positive, but perhaps the newer SATA cards are really designed for computers so the "old" hard drives can be eliminated. Eventually these cards may make it into cameras, but it would take quite a bit of redesign. This would be years and a few generations down the road.

Ed, I'm pretty sure CFast cards are to replace Compact Flash as a small storage card for devices/cameras. Though it certainly could be used in a normal computer (as Compact Flash before it could) it probably wouldn't be ideal by a long shot, and I wouldn't want to rely on it.

As for needing quite a bit of a redesign. I figure there's already quite a bit of a redesign going on in successive generations unless it's a Nikon style incremental update (s models). That said there are a lot of good reasons to move to to CFast, it simplifies design with fewer traces that need to be dealt with and should have a significantly more resilient connector (no more tiny easy to bend pins).

Though you're right it's likely a generation away. I doubt Canon went CFast in the Mk.4's due to the availability of media, and the same is probably true with the D4/D4x. Given the timing of things, we might see CFast in a mid-tier body between the 4th gen pro bodies and the 5th gen pro bodies though.