Imported gear: customs/GST

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04-27-2009, 02:08 AM
Jay Gould

Australian BPNers: Imported gear - customs/GST

Hi, I had an interesting experience at DD Photographics. Went there to look at backpacks - liked the Lowepro Computrekker AW - small and light.

While there the owner/manager? asked me what gear I was buying. I told him that I was buying a 1D3 from Digi Direct as they had the lowest price for the body with a Canon Australian Warranty, and that the price we only a couple of hundred more than the USA price taking into account the exchange rate.

I also told him that lenses on the other hand were much less expensive in the USA than in Australia. he first said that he disagreed because he recently sold a 400 at the same price as the USA.

I told him that the 300 f/2.8 was $4,100USD/$5,760AUD; his price was approx. $6,600AUD.

Now, this is what the thread is all about. He then said to be sure and have a proper valuation document from Adorama because according to the Australian Customs website if the value is in excess of $1,000 it must be declared, I am considered an importer, I must pay 10% Customs on the value, and if I didn't declare and I was caught, I would pay the 10% and an additional 15% penalty.

I told him "no, worries mate" (see, I can be an Australian); I intend to determine if I must declare it and if so I will and I will pay the 10% and it will still cost me less than his price.

So, what are the BPNers experience bringing in goods in excess of $1,000 from Adorama, B&H, or elsewhere overseas?

Thanks, Jay
04-28-2009, 09:24 PM
Christopher C.M. Cooke

Jay as an Officer of the Court I am surprised that you ask such a silly question.

We keepers of the law have a responsibility to see that it upheld and retains its authority over all citizens.

Of course you don't declare it.

The secret is DON'T have any boxes with you just your camera gear. If you need the boxes post them home.
04-28-2009, 10:15 PM
Ákos Lumnitzer

Talk to a relative and wire them the money and they can send you as gift. Your invoice etc can be mailed separately later.

Alternatively, be honest and pay your taxes. After all enough Aussies are rorting the system as is and given the current economic climate and the fact it is also reaching us at the end of the world, we wish to ensure that our chosen government officials will have enough money so they can retire at 40 years of age at around 120k pa. Please help them. We don't want to encourage our lovely overseas guests to do the same thus corrupting them in the process - if they are not already by the sounds of it. :D

Personally, I would not buy from ANY Aussie gray importer at all anymore.
04-28-2009, 11:21 PM
Marc Mol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christopher C.M. Cooke

Jay as an Officer of the Court I am surprised that you ask such a silly question.

We keepers of the law have a responsibility to see that it upheld and retains its authority over all citizens.

Of course you don't declare it.

The secret is DON'T have any boxes with you just your camera gear. If you need the boxes post them home.

Chris
I think you'll find that Jay is talking about buying the gear from a US company and getting it SENT via that method. The companies he's referring to WILL NOT undervalue the item or declare it as a GIFT.
BTW, I am an Officer of Australian Customs and I'll pretend I didn't hear that! :D:D:D
To answer Jay's question:
I have bought quite a bit of DSLR gear from B&H in the past (mostly under A$1000, however) and never had any problems.

Cheers
Marc
04-29-2009, 01:13 AM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christopher C.M. Cooke

Jay as an Officer of the Court I am surprised that you ask such a silly question.

We keepers of the law have a responsibility to see that it upheld and retains its authority over all citizens.

Of course you don't declare it.

The secret is DON'T have any boxes with you just your camera gear. If you need the boxes post them home.

A most interesting response!

Since you have assumed that I was returning with the gear let me tell you a little story.

When I returned in October I declared all of my new camera gear - I had been using it for several months; of course I didn't have any boxes. Why I declared is not for discussion.

Guess what - no duty or GST on the gear. I was told since I had been using the gear, it was for personal consumption, no duty or GST.

Moral: you don't always get burned playing the game properly.
04-29-2009, 01:16 AM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ákos Lumnitzer

Talk to a relative and wire them the money and they can send you as gift. Your invoice etc can be mailed separately later.

Alternatively, be honest and pay your taxes. After all enough Aussies are rorting the system as is and given the current economic climate and the fact it is also reaching us at the end of the world, we wish to ensure that our chosen government officials will have enough money so they can retire at 40 years of age at around 120k pa. Please help them. We don't want to encourage our lovely overseas guests to do the same thus corrupting them in the process - if they are not already by the sounds of it. :D

Personally, I would not buy from ANY Aussie gray importer at all anymore.

Akos, the gift game does not work and it does not exempt you from GST.

Gifts no longer works as of 2008; if it did I would have everything shipped to my brother in California and then he could forward it to me.

Customs in fact suggested that I have Adorama divide the stuff so that all of the small stuff is put in box valued at less than $1000 and there would not be any GST on that box.

From the Customs Website:

9 FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS

9.3 My goods were sent as a gift, so why should I pay anything at all?
The laws about Customs Duty and GST apply to all imported goods, including gifts. When a gift is sent to you from overseas, the law says that you are the owner of that gift and you are liable for any Duty and GST payable. However, there is a “gift concession” that may reduce your duty and GST liability, if Customs is satisfied that those goods are indeed a gift6.

The gift concession was to a maximum of $200 and was eliminated in 2008: "...Customs will be revoking the gift concession (by-law number 9740019) on and from 1 October 2008.
04-29-2009, 01:21 AM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marc Molloy

Chris
I think you'll find that Jay is talking about buying the gear from a US company and getting it SENT via that method.

The companies he's referring to WILL NOT undervalue the item or declare it as a GIFT.
BTW, I am an Officer of Australian Customs and I'll pretend I didn't hear that! :D:D:D

To answer Jay's question:
I have bought quite a bit of DSLR gear from B&H in the past (mostly under A$1000, however) and never had any problems.

Cheers
Marc

Marc - BUSTED!! You have given me a lovely giggle regarding your response to Chris.

Question: I have told Adorama to create different shipments so that no shipment is greater than $700 including shipping to keep each shipment under $1,000 Australia. I will be receiving three separate shipments under $1,000. Additionally, I will receive one shipment substantially over $1,000 - my three lenses.

Cool to create the less than $1,000 shipments even though I bought them all on the same day and I have instructed Adorama to ship them each on a different day?

This Bird Forum is just like the subjects of the Forum; you never know from where the next Bird/Member is could to fly in from! Australian Customs - outstanding.

Cheers, Jay

Where are you located? Not indicated in your identification.
04-29-2009, 01:21 AM
Ákos Lumnitzer

Jay,

You seem to know enough already and to me if you are spending that much money on your new gear then I really cannot see what the problem is in paying the 10%. You have found the FAQ section and point 9 yet cannot find a phone number to ask them yourself?

That's exactly what I did every time I ordered and what I would do in future. :D
04-29-2009, 01:31 AM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ákos Lumnitzer

Jay,

You seem to know enough already and to me if you are spending that much money on your new gear then I really cannot see what the problem is in paying the 10%. You have found the FAQ section and point 9 yet cannot find a phone number to ask them yourself?

That's exactly what I did every time I ordered and what I would do in future. :D

I did call them after posting the original post. Sometimes you learn for your fellow cyber hunters; other times you don't.

Frankly, if it is legal and within the game to break the items down into less than $1,000 shipments to avoid the 10%, why no do so? If you want to take the implied suggestions to an extreme you should never buy overseas when you can buy in Australia.
04-29-2009, 01:41 AM
Ákos Lumnitzer

Just be careful of freight charges multiplied out for each parcel.

Would this mean they will send you your lens in pieces and you will assemble? Wish you the best.
04-29-2009, 01:44 AM
Marc Mol
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay Gould

Guess what - no duty or GST on the gear. I was told since I had been using the gear, it was for personal consumption, no duty or GST.

Moral: you don't always get burned playing the game properly.

Hi Jay
Was this the answer that ACS (Customs) gave you??
As this is only partially correct.

Personal goods are free from duty and tax if they are:
- owned and used by you overseas for 12 months or more
- imported temporarily (a security may be required by Customs)
For other goods, limits apply. These include goods that are purchased overseas and goods that are purchased in Australia duty or tax free (that have been previously exported), or from an inwards duty free shop on arrival into Australia. Also included are goods for which a TRS claim has been made.
Duty free concessions do not apply to commercial goods.
General goods
If you are aged 18 years or over, you can bring up to A$900 worth of general goods into Australia duty-free. If you are under 18 years of age there is a A$450 limit. General goods include gifts, souvenirs, cameras, electronic equipment, leather goods, perfume concentrates, jewellery, watches and sporting equipment.

...........................it's the public servant in me...........;)

Cheers
Marc
04-29-2009, 01:50 AM
Marc Mol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay Gould

This Bird Forum is just like the subjects of the Forum; you never know from where the next Bird/Member is could to fly in from! Australian Customs - outstanding.

Cheers, Jay

Where are you located? Not indicated in your identification.

Thanks Jay. I'm at SKSA, Sydney Airport. Voted the WORST Airport in Australia!!
Moral..............never sell your Major Airport to a bank, I'm sure you know which bank....no, no ...not that one! The other one.:D

Cheers
Marc
04-29-2009, 02:00 AM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ákos Lumnitzer

Just be careful of freight charges multiplied out for each parcel.

Would this mean they will send you your lens in pieces and you will assemble? Wish you the best.

Cute! ;)

I will look at the shipping charges and determine if the 10% GST savings is in fact a savings!!
04-29-2009, 02:03 AM
Jay Gould
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Molloy

Hi Jay
Was this the answer that ACS (Customs) gave you??
As this is only partially correct.

Personal goods are free from duty and tax if they are:

owned and used by you overseas for 12 months or more
imported temporarily (a security may be required by Customs)

For other goods, limits apply. These include goods that are purchased overseas and goods that are purchased in Australia duty or tax free (that have been previously exported), or from an inwards duty free shop on arrival into Australia. Also included are goods for which a TRS claim has been made.
Duty free concessions do not apply to commercial goods.
General goods
If you are aged 18 years or over, you can bring up to A$900 worth of general goods into Australia duty-free. If you are under 18 years of age there is a A$450 limit. General goods include gifts, souvenirs, cameras, electronic equipment, leather goods, perfume concentrates, jewellery, watches and sporting equipment.
...........................it's the public servant in me...........;)
Cheers
Marc
I played the game straight; they knew we had been overseas only six months. For the sake of completeness we itemized the $900 each and then I included on my docket an extra $4,000 for the camera equipment. No charge for the extra $4,000.00 Cheers, Jay
04-29-2009, 03:46 AM
Christopher C.M. Cooke

Posted by Marc

Quote:

BTW, I am an Officer of Australian Customs and I'll pretend I didn't hear that!

Bugger, there goes my overseas trip to Bali, anyone looking for a hardly used body board and bag and I am sorry officer I thought that white powder in my cameras was silica gel.:)
04-29-2009, 03:52 AM
Ákos Lumnitzer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay Gould

Cute! ;)

I will look at the shipping charges and determine if the 10% GST savings is in fact a savings!!

I am glad you got the tongue in cheek. :D

Good luck Jay. Now go and do some photography! You are in some great country up there near Bris-vegas. :)
04-29-2009, 05:26 AM
Simon Bennett

Goodness what a thread.

Regarding Discount Digital Photographics: I have found them to be a reputable firm, and I have bought a number of camera's and (very expensive) lenses from them. This includes a Canon 40D camera which they repaired under their warranty when it developed Err 99 at 11 months of age. Be aware that grey import camera's are not covered by a Canon factory warranty - and may not even be accepted for repair by Canon - although there are other places who can repair after the warranty expire. I understand that grey import lenses are covered by a Canon factory warranty, although I have never needed a warranty repair on a lens to test this.

Regarding the $1000 limit on importing duty free items traveling with you. This can be increased by pooling the allowance with your family members (and others?) traveling with you. So $1000 becomes $2000 if your partner does not want to bring in a camera or anything else.
04-29-2009, 06:35 AM
Christopher C.M. Cooke

Quote:

Marc - BUSTED!! You have given me a lovely giggle regarding your response to Chris.

I suspect that I sense a rather fractious attitude here rather than one that evokes the camaraderie that I always thought this forum projects.

It is just possible Jay that you may disturb the friendship that has always been so much part of this forum by your adversarial rather than helpful attitude, I sincerely hope not.

This is a friendly place and if it ceases to be so it will certainly have one less member
04-29-2009, 06:56 AM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simon Bennett

Goodness what a thread.

Regarding Discount Digital Photographics: I have found them to be a reputable firm, and I have bought a number of camera's and (very expensive) lenses from them. This includes a Canon 40D camera which they repaired under their warranty when it developed Err 99 at 11 months of age. Be aware that grey import camera's are not covered by a Canon factory warranty - and may not even be accepted for repair by Canon - although there are other places who can repair after the warranty expire. I understand that grey import lenses are covered by a Canon factory warranty, although I have never needed a warranty repair on a lens to test this.

Regarding the $1000 limit on importing duty free items traveling with you. This can be increased by pooling the allowance with your family members (and others?) traveling with you. So $1000 becomes $2000 if your partner does not want to bring in a camera or anything else.

Simon, there is nothing in what I said that is in any way negative about DD Photographics. I really appreciate that they gave me a heads up regarding the GST 10% issue. Did you read my post otherwise?

As Marc pointed out it is $900, and yes when we returned from overseas in October we did pool our allowance; the camera gear I declared was in excess of our allowance.
04-29-2009, 06:58 AM
Marc Mol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simon Bennett

Goodness what a thread.

Regarding Discount Digital Photographics: I have found them to be a reputable firm, and I have bought a number of camera's and (very expensive) lenses from them.

I can vouch for D&D Photographics as well.;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simon Bennett

Regarding the $1000 limit on importing duty free items traveling with you. This can be increased by pooling the allowance with your family members (and others?) traveling with you. So $1000 becomes $2000 if your partner does not want to bring in a camera or anything else.

Pretty close, it's A$900 concession (A$450 under 18) partner = A$1800, etc.
04-29-2009, 07:07 AM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christopher C.M. Cooke

I suspect that I sense a rather fractious attitude here rather than one that evokes the camaraderie that I always thought this forum projects.

It is just possible Jay that you may disturb the friendship that has always been so much part of this forum by your adversarial rather than helpful attitude, I sincerely hope not.

This is a friendly place and if it ceases to be so it will certainly have one less member

Frankly, I have no idea what you are talking about. :confused:

Tongue in cheek or otherwise, the last thing anyone expected in response to your suggestion that I not declare goods upon returning to Australia was that one of the BPN members is also a member of Australian Customs :cool:. I find that hysterical :D:D; it is like the "walls have ears" :eek:. If you do not see the humor in what occurred, OK, that is you choice.

Let's not disturb the BPN harmony.

Edit addition:

I just reread the entire thread and I think - just a guess! - that the need to defend DD Photographics may have resulted from Akos' statement:

Quote:

Personally, I would not buy from ANY Aussie gray importer at all anymore.

I don't have any problem with a gray importer - they are valuable and valid businesses just like any other; it is my understanding that Canon actually refers customers to DD to obtain lenses. Lenses do have an international warranty unlike camera bodies.
04-29-2009, 07:12 AM
Christopher C.M. Cooke

Quote:

Let's not disturb the BPN harmony.

Thank you Jay, I agree.
04-29-2009, 07:25 AM
Christopher C.M. Cooke

Jay,

From Marc

Quote:

Thanks Jay. I'm at SKSA, Sydney Airport. Voted the WORST Airport in Australia!!
Moral..............never sell your Major Airport to a bank, I'm sure you know which bank....no, no ...not that one! The other one.:D

As I am sure that Marc would know, he should not divulge his position in his department, location of that department or any opinions concerning the administration of that department, or of any port or point of entry into Australia on any public forum,

I am sure his department head would not be too happy with that.

I am also sure Jay that you should know not to compromise the position of any Federal Officer on any public forum.

So think carefully before you put any of our members at any risk, simply to prosecute your whims.

PS What about posting some photos? Or have we missed them? If we have I apologise unreservedly
04-29-2009, 02:27 PM
Jay Gould

Quote:

Originally Posted by Christopher C.M. Cooke

Jay,

From Marc

As I am sure that Marc would know, he should not divulge his position in his department, location of that department or any opinions concerning the administration of that department, or of any port or point of entry into Australia on any public forum,

I am sure his department head would not be too happy with that.

I am also sure Jay that you should know not to compromise the position of any Federal Officer on any public forum.

So think carefully before you put any of our members at any risk, simply to prosecute your whims.

PS What about posting some photos? Or have we missed them? If we have I apologise unreservedly

Chris, earlier you wrote quite moralistically:

Quote:

It is just possible Jay that you may disturb the friendship that has always been so much part of this forum by your adversarial rather than helpful attitude, I sincerely hope not.

Chris, you clearly have a problem which has resulted in the necessity for you to chastise both Marc and me. I haven't figured out what your problem is; frankly I doubt I will give much more thought.

Using my computer clock in Brisbane, last night at 10:12pm

You wrote:

Quote:

Quote:
<table width="100%" border="0" cellpadding="8" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr> <td class="alt2" style="border: 1px inset ;"> Let's not disturb the BPN harmony. </td> </tr> </tbody></table>
Thank you Jay, I agree.

13 minutes later you had this urgent need to tell/share with the the world your moralistic position regarding me and Marc. Mate, at the end of the day, you are the only one who suggested to disregard the law and not declare goods when returning to Australia. Marc called you on it and I guess you are still chaffing from being gently busted.

I will say it again - perhaps you did not understand: Let's not disturb the BPN harmony.

Regarding my posting photos, I will remind you what I said in some other earlier post. I am currently recovering from knee surgery and therefore rather sedentary - I am still not quite ready to go play "shoot the birds". I will post images when I am ready to post images; not when someone else thinks I should post images rather than continue to ask appropriate educational questions.

The BPN is heavily skewed towards posting images that have been substantially PP in PS. I have just opened the book on PS; when I have a working knowledge of the program so that I can post ETL PP images, I will do so. Thank you for asking.

Concluding for a third time: Lets not disturb the BPN harmony "... that has always been so much part of this forum by your adversarial rather than helpful attitude ...".
04-29-2009, 10:02 PM
Ákos Lumnitzer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay Gould

I just reread the entire thread and I think - just a guess! - that the need to defend DD Photographics may have resulted from Akos' statement:

I don't have any problem with a gray importer - they are valuable and valid businesses just like any other; it is my understanding that Canon actually refers customers to DD to obtain lenses. Lenses do have an international warranty unlike camera bodies.

That's fine if you have no problem.

A person I used to associate with was screwed around for about six weeks last year when he wanted to buy a $6000 lens from them. They never even had the courtesy to tell him what's going on; no, he had to chase them consistently and was getting run around answers. AFAIC that is poor customer service and does not deserve a cent from me from that point forward. Though I must say that I never had that problem with them when I bought gear from them prior to that occasion - in all honesty it has been quite pleasant. But that experience this person had was bad enough from my perspective.

I would rather pay more and buy from Canon Aus or import it myself. But I don't penny pinch and go for cheapest. I am always happy to pay for something if I can have it there and then (within reason of course).