Not all the bears are spring cubs

[Steve Uffman]

Another image from Chas Glatzer's terrific black bear plus workshop...It takes big bears to make little bears and this bear had that swagger.

As you know wildlife will often use people trails for convenience. I was in no position to deny right of way

Not long afterwards, I witnessed a mama bear with four cubs vigorously chase this big bear away into the woods.

All comments, tips and feedback very much welcomed as I continue to experiment in sharpening strategy.

Canon 7d 70-200mm f/2.8L II at 80mm 1/640sec f /2.8 ISO 400 processed on Desktop with a bad monitor (NEC on its way)

LR4 for toning down the lush green, a bit of spot removal on the bear, and reducing a bit of color tinting on the bear although this one did have a bit of iridescent tone. CS6 and Nik dfine and Color Efex 4 Tonal Contrast at about half default values.

[Mark Wiseman]

Hi Steve, lovely detail and composition. I like the way the path leads the eye into the image.
Thanks for sharing and best wishes,
Mark.

[Steve Kaluski]

Hi Steve, same issues as previous posting.

Steve

[Steve Uffman]

removed blues and magenta and increased blacks on the wet fur. Thought about darkening the bear a bit more but truth is the wet fur had some reflective qualities. Also add some selective sharpening on the bear and grasses around the bear. tone down the greens a bit more. For better or worse?

all help welcomed.

[Ken Watkins]

Steve,

I did not find the OP to have the same problems as before, but I do find the re-post to be rather too Black. I feel that you may be over complicating your processing, Could you post a JPEG straight from the RAW file as it could give some more information to work from.

[Steve Uffman]

Thanks Ken...Very much appreciate the interest and help....This exercise is sort of bracketing the image processing until I get it right...hopefully it will get me there.

Here are two JPGs that I exported directly from the raw using Lightroom's export feature to the preset I created for BPN (sizing). I don't know if you wanted it sharpened for the screen or not. So I exported the top image with default sharpening for the screen and the second had it turned off.

As you can see in the original image, the bear has that magenta cast on its back-the iridescence I talked about. But I will say this, the reds and magentas have always seemed a bit hot coming out of my 7D. First noticed it after I first got the camera when I took some images of butterflies on Reddish Pink Dianthus and the instructor commented on "something going on that is funky" with that color....Of course, I have no idea what the rest of you see since my confidence in my monitor is weak

These images do contain "stuff " the top left corner that was distracting that I cleaned up in later images.

[Steve Uffman]

Thanks Ken...Very much appreciate the interest and help....This exercise is sort of bracketing the image processing until I get it right...hopefully it will get me there.

Here are two JPGs that I exported directly from the raw using Lightroom's export feature to the preset I created for BPN (sizing). I don't know if you wanted it sharpened for the screen or not. So I exported the top image with default sharpening in the export process for the screen turned off and the second had it turned on.

As you can see in the original image, the bear has that magenta cast on its back-the iridescence I talked about. But I will say this, the reds and magentas have always seemed a bit hot coming out of my 7D.

First noticed it after I first got the camera when I took some images of butterflies on Reddish Pink Dianthus and the instructor commented on "something going on that is funky" with that color...It seemed over-saturated in that channel. Of course, I have no idea what the rest of you see since my confidence in my monitor is weak

I do know that Sid Garige took a fine image of the same bear... although it was likely in different light as the sun went in and out of clouds. His also was off the trail so there likely was little reflection from the limestone on the trail.. His image appeared more black and did not show the iridescence . He shot his with a 1dIV.

One other note-These images do contain "stuff " in the top left corner that was distracting that I cleaned up in my more processed images.

One other question besides the blackness would be sharpening. Did the repost appear to have too little or too much? or the wrong things sharpened or not IYO?

Again, thanks for the interest and help...

[Ken Watkins]

Steve,

Although it is extremely difficult to judge from these small JPEG , I think that both of the JPEGS seem more natural!
I do not use LR so really cannot offer anything on your processing there.
If you have PS just open as RAW and try to adjust to the colour you like best, the magenta cast is best fixed by adjusting the tint slider towards green, but not too much. You can also "warm up" the image a little by sliding the white balance slightly right.

When you have the RAW file adjusted and open you are ready to do whatever you like. I tend to use Nik Software mostly and mainly Color Efex Pro 4, in particular the detail extractor, but carefully.

If you are still not happy with the colour balance then individual adjustments can be made via Selective colour, in this case I would definitely try to reduce the green a little. From other images taken on this trip the grass and vegetation certainly seem lush.

When you are happy then apply some sharpening, I usually use Smart Sharpen but very gently if necessary applying small amounts more than once (a tip I picked up from Art).

I only hope you have PS!

[Steve Uffman]

Thanks Ken so much...I am a huge Nik Fan and use Color Efex 4 on most images. I used to use White Neutralizer on most but found I often ended up with a bit bluish or less warm tones than I prefer on mammals.. The first bear I posted from the trip was evidence of that. I am familiar with the tint slider but had not thought of that to adjust the magenta. I usually do that with sliders in LR4. I used the target adjustment brush in LR4 to tone down the greens (per tip from Chas). Also previously, I would set the white balance to cloudy when shooting mammals as I felt it warmed the images in a manner I preferred. My default recipe runs TC at about 50% of the default values and then I have been selectively using Detail Extractor in areas that I either want to bring out detail in darker areas or with a minus control point to reduce or blur detail (backgrounds-particularly when I want to add depth perception to vegetation). I have now cut the intensity of the Detail Extractor from defaults about 50% as well (to your point of being careful)

I do have CS6, but to be truthful, I can do so much in Nik, so quickly that I have not practiced in CS6 as much. However on this image I did use the spot healing brush with content aware to clean up the "stuff" that I found distracting in the top left corner. My goal this quarter is to get over the hump on CS6 as I am redoing my website and have a mountain of images that need proper post processing before I show them to anybody.

[Harshad Barve]

I will stay out of tech discussions but excellent image with great potential
TFS

[Rachel Hollander]

Steve - Can't really help with the tech issues because I don't use Nik. I do have a 7D though and I've found that I'm better off shooting with AWB and then adjusting at time of conversion (whether using ACR or DPP) because the cloudy setting often introduced a cast. I do like the comp here and think it is an image worth working on too.

TFS,
Rachel

[Ken Watkins]

Rachel,

I must admit that I missed the White balance point I always use AWB and adjust later as necessary.

[Steve Kaluski]

Hi Steve, you will find that Canon tend to go warmer i.e. Reds & Yellows, Nikon will go cooler, Blues & Greens. What would be good is if both you & Sid have almost identical shots, as both, if I'm correct, shoot with the 7D, then perhaps we could do a form of comparison, but this would need to be elsewhere on the Forum. If you are getting Blues & Magentas you need to correct this elsewhere within the RAW convertor, otherwise it effects everything else.

Again I think you were fighting for light based on the techs, I would again have upped the ISO so you can increase your DOF. I you look at the first image in pane 6, it's pretty good, both in terms of colour (Blacks look good & the vegetation) and comp, what has happened in the OP & RP I have no idea?????

Steve ultimately all you need is to reduce the Red & Blue in the bear and apply sharpening. If you knew how to compress the file and fwd it to me I could take a look and perhaps advise you on some steps as the RAW file is too big to mail. I'll have a ponder now back, just ploughing through truck loads of mail & PM's. :w3

Steve

[Steve Uffman]

Here is another pass at the image with alterations to WB, some slider adjustments to remove a bit of the translucence in the bears coat. A bit more sharpening globally. Also changed the export process as LR4 export could no longer save the file smaller than 250K, so saved for web in CS6 after sizing, and optimization for file size , used bicubic sharpener


Thoughts?

Also know how sincerely I appreciate the help and feedback....I think I am going to get over that hump...I think I am going to get over that hump....I think I am going to get over that hump.....etc.

[Steve Uffman]

Hi Steve, you will find that Canon tend to go warmer i.e. Reds & Yellows, Nikon will go cooler, Blues & Greens. What would be good is if both you & Sid have almost identical shots, as both, if I'm correct, shoot with the 7D, then perhaps we could do a form of comparison, but this would need to be elsewhere on the Forum. If you are getting Blues & Magentas you need to correct this elsewhere within the RAW convertor, otherwise it effects everything else.

Again I think you were fighting for light based on the techs, I would again have upped the ISO so you can increase your DOF. I you look at the first image in pane 6, it's pretty good, both in terms of colour (Blacks look good & the vegetation) and comp, what has happened in the OP & RP I have no idea?????

Steve ultimately all you need is to reduce the Red & Blue in the bear and apply sharpening. If you knew how to compress the file and fwd it to me I could take a look and perhaps advise you on some steps as the RAW file is too big to mail. I'll have a ponder now back, just ploughing through truck loads of mail & PM's. :w3

Steve

Appreciate it Steve. The problem with light this morning is we had scattered sunshine after a morning rain....As this bear moved towards me the sun dipped again behind a cloud and I spun the aperture dial versus the changing the ISO (quicker for me) because as you can see, he just about was out of the frame as I had already zoomed in at 80mm on the 70-200. In the series of shots as he was coming to me I go from f/6.3 to f/2.8. Hindsight, I should have just upped the ISO all morning. The 5dIII was at 800-1000 most of this session.

[Morkel Erasmus]

I am not going to rehash the other critiques, Steve.
Your last repost is much too 'crunchy' and contrasty...here's one I worked up from your "unsharpened" JPG.
I felt the vertical crop works best since there's not much in the original comp that adds for me...
Selectively sharpened the bear and his face again.
You needed to up exposure compensation to get details in the ears...:e3
The snout and nose/mouth seems to be just out of focus as well...

WDYT?? (obviously will look better if worked from high res RAW)


The 5dIII was at 800-1000 most of this session. Weren't you shooting the 7D here?

[Steve Uffman]

Yes , I was shooting both...had the 5dIII on the tripod and the 7d over my shoulder.....I was shooting a higher ISO on the ones in the woods ....but this was a day of tough changing light post a front passing through the area....As soon as you got an exposure off the grass or another midtone, the lighting would shift......when this occurred I had been focusing on a brown yearling deeper in the woods when I saw this guy come out......I have always been hesitant to go too high an ISO on the 7d but certainly 800 is acceptable.....

I like the vertical and did one early on the image that I never sent.....I did some cleanup with some of the content aware spot healing brush on the one I posted that was pretty aggressive. I was curious whether anyone would comment on that but the main goal is to get the sense of when sharpening is enough and when its not....

On my repost, I thought is was blocky as well...Although the rain did matte the coat a bit....An yes, there are several parts of the bear that I thought were not as focused as I would like....which is why I picked it for the drill. at f/2.8, I was actually surprised how much of the bear was in focus....but I was fairly close to the bear so the DOF was not as narrow as I would have thought.

do agree on the ears and the shaded side of the face...but he only raised his head and looked for an instant so it is what it is....I was shooting most of the day +1 or so off of the grass but it was a tough day for the lighting conditions. with the midtones in the sun one moment and clouds the next, I simply am not fast enough with the metering to get every exposure spot on.

[Steve Kaluski]

Hi Steve, I think it's going in the right direction, however we are now going more into Workflow rather than critique, so perhaps there are a few things we can do between us to move this along. I think also having a new calibrated monitor will really boost your outlook to the images.

cheers
Steve

[Steve Uffman]

Terrific....I took a break from the sharpening drills and put a new bear portrait up moments ago...good news on that image is I could play in the areas I am already comfortable...wet fur was already chunky so really did minimal sharpening and focused on the Nik stuff.

[Sid Garige]

Here are two JPGs that I exported directly from the raw using Lightroom's export feature to the preset I created for BPN (sizing). I don't know if you wanted it sharpened for the screen or not. So I exported the top image with default sharpening in the export process for the screen turned off and the second had it turned on.

As you can see in the original image, the bear has that magenta cast on its back-the iridescence I talked about.

Steve,
I opened image1 in pane 6 in photoshop and sRBG profile was embedded into that. Chas changed both of our cameras to Adobe RBG so I assume your light room workflow is fine and embedding sRBG profile when you save for the web. I guess you are right about post processing with NIK and CS6 is where you are loosing your color profile. After NIK and CS6 when you save for the web see if "Embed color Profile" is checked. Enabling this embeds sRBG color profile to your image.

[Charles Glatzer]

Steve,

Try using Selective Color to reduce the color cast(s) within the bear. Using this method you can negate the cast without introducing another. Knowing a bit about complimentary colors will be of benefit.

Red-Cyan
Green-Magenta
Blue-Yellow

Chas

[Steve Uffman]

Thanks Chas, the whole color thing is a side of my brain that I have not used much....That is why my wife has to dress me before I go out in public ..:w3....

Anyway I am going to have to get into that now that I will be able to see a better rendering of the capture..but part of the issue on this image had to do with the colorspace. You helped me with that on my notebook when we had our class...like a dunce, I did not move all the settings to my desktop which is where I do most of my editing...anyway, New Monitor gets here Friday..I have made the setting changes on both desktop and laptop....so looking forward to some good progress here.

...After the color cast ,sharpening feedback on this image (which I picked to post because it had many problems ), I did use the selective color sliders in lightroom to see the impact. knowing the complimentary colors will as you say be a benefit. To remove the cast on this image, the purple slider had the most impact on the back of the bear.

While I am at it, I do want to tip my hat to all the folks that have so graciously provided help and coaching on this....great benefit of BPN

[Steve Uffman]

Jumped on learning Smart Sharpen today....pretty cool, and actually pretty simple..did take a bit of time to get used to the big % though