Have you learnt anything from BPN and is it worth the membership fee?

[Tom Rambaut]

I thought I would start this and do hope it is in the right place. I thought about this when someone I know, who has about the same level experience as me (not alot), said that he had looked at the website but objected to paying to become a member. He also thought that Arthur Morris was too opinionated. My thinking is forget what you think of someone and ask yourself what can I learn from them - You can learn a stack from Morris as well as the other moderators on this forum.I said that I thought it was worth the money and further that my photography had progressed since joining.

In answer to the first part of my question - yes I have learnt something, infact I seem to learn things when I look at all the images and their critiques, furthermore I've learnt from the critiques of my own posted Images. I'm certainly more aware as to what I'm trying to accomplish out in the field. I see images of others and try to replicate them in the field.

Some of the points that I have picked up on are:

1 - Head Angle
2 - getting low - for shore birds.
3 - exposure theory
4 - composition - I used to crop too tight.

There are of course many areas that I need to work on - don't get me started on flash work.

The answer to the second part of the question is yes. I think it is worth joining up and becoming a member. Certainly easier that using a third party server to post images.

[Leo Berzins]

I think it's a bargain.

I don't understand why anyone would spend thousands on camera gear and quibble about twenty bucks to join the best forum available for constructive feedback on images rather than the more common "Great shot" sites. Not to mention all the free educational resources available to everyone regardless of membership.

Reminds me of golf where most people happily spend money on new equipment but won't spend money on a lesson or two from a pro.

I joined BPN soon after getting my first SLR and while I haven't been as active as I would like, I've learnt heaps here and try to put that acquired knowledge into practice every time I get out in the field.

[Roman Kurywczak]

Great discussion Tom! I love the fact that you have realized that for $20.....quite the bargain! Always a pleasure to see people learning from the site! I do believe comments like these keep the mods going!!! Thanks!!!

[Dan Brown]

20 bucks? It's more than a bargain!!! On top of what has already been mentioned, where in the heck are you going to learn postprocessing using just about every piece of software known to man that is specifically targeted to bird images??? And then learn OOTB techniques, HDR, Stitching, etc, etc!!! I learn every day from the participants and mods here! But, I guess I just have a lot to learn!!
$20 is a super bargain (but $21 would be way too much, so don't raise the fee guys:bg3::bg3:).

[jack williamson]

Before I found this site I did not know how to present an image on the web. I had never heard of head

angle. It is certainely worth $20.00. As I have said before, the moderators and all of the people who give

feedback are terrific and I thank you.

Jack

[Jay Gould]

The problem with this thread, and it is not to put it down, is that it is preaching to the choir.

Frankly, and this is my personal bias, I have little time for the long-term Forum Participant. I have yet to read a satisfactory explanation why someone after 3, 6, 9 months and longer continue to participate and refuse to spend $20/year.

Anyone who spends more than one minute thinking whether to spend $20 for a full year of education from the members and the experts here should reevaluate their determination of the value of a dollar.

The BPN leaders had decided that There Shalt Be Long-Term Forum Participants; therefore, while I disagree with their personal decision to take without participating in the costs of running this amazing site, I will respond to their images no differently than I would to a member's images.

I am constantly extolling the virtues of this site to any and all photographers that I meet. As long as they appear to have an open mind; I will continue to explain the overwhelming benefits of BPN membership. As soon as I experience that they are shutting down because of the $20/year cost I move on. Frankly, you choose your friends and associates; not your reles. Photographers that spend thousands of dollars on equipment and want a free education ride are not in my World.

When I was starting out a few years ago and receiving significant encouragement from Artie and others I learned that other sites had a lifetime membership. I pushed the leaders to create a lifetime membership and still believe that the $300 I spent is a bargain.

What have I learned from BPN? Photography is a passion and an addiction. It is an addictive passion because I get off on creating an image - today landscape/yesterday BIF - that requires less and less post processing, and the reason for "less and less" is the education and encouragement received here on BPN.

Simple as that! :5

Thank you BPN, its leaders, experts/professionals, and members, for assisting me and encouraging me to expand my life through photography.

:cheers:

[John Hawkins]

I would wager your friend blows more than 20.00 on worse things.

[Ed Cordes]

I agree with all of the above. The OP's points of:

1 - Head Angle
2 - getting low - for shore birds.
3 - exposure theory
4 - composition - I used to crop too tight.


are absolutely correct. I have also learned many, many post processing tips. For $20 it is a great buy.

[Robert Amoruso]

Thanks everyone for the kind words. It is good to know were are appreciated. As stated our goal is to provide something more then the Great Shot comment so prevalent on other sites. We want you to say why you think it is a great shot - better yet what can be improved and how.

Besides having someone critique your own images, providing critiques yourself helps you to be more observant of details and more discerning of your own work as well. This translates to better image making.

[Roger Clark]

Adding to what Robert said, I also think it is interesting to see people's different perspectives on the pluses and minuses of an image.

Roger

[Ofer Levy]

Another vote for becoming a member at the price of one Sushi lunch a year...
I think BPN is a great forum especially because some of the stuff (AND some of the members - myself included) are so terribly opinionated....:bg3:<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
I have learnt everything I know about wildlife photography in forums such as BPN. BPN is especially great because it is still a critique forum unlike other similar forums which have become more of a support group with a lot of “great shot mate!” kind of comments. BPN stuff and members aren't afraid to give honest (sometimes brutal) critique – which I think is great.<o:p></o:p>
Receiving sugar coated comments will not improve anyone’s photography so straight forward and honest critique is the only way to go IMHO. When commenting (sometimes even disagreeing with others) I have learnt a lot. The fact that we can repost an image with our suggestions is a great learning tool for everyone – especially when it stirs up a discussion.<o:p></o:p>
All in all, I think that BPN is the last real critique forum out there so I strongly suggest to anyone who is interested to improve his/her photography to join as a member and support this great place.<o:p></o:p>
Few things to remember - there is no such thing as a PERFECT wildlife image. There is no such thing as a guru when it comes to bird photography. Even the best photographers in here and elsewhere don’t know everything and there is always room for improvement. Getting an excellent wildlife shot is a small miracle which doesn’t happen often and usually takes a lot of effort and skill. I guess this is why we tend to be so emotionally involved with our work and sometimes take “negative”critique as a personal insult….:w3<o:p></o:p>
Happy shooting,<o:p></o:p>
Ofer<o:p></o:p>

[Ofer Levy]

Where you see the word stuff it should be staff of course....:bg3:

[Nick Palmieri]

$20 is a bargain for this sight! Sometimes you have to be thick skinned! You don't have to agree with the critiques but use them as needed to improve your skills. My photography has grown logarithmically since joining BPN. Well worth the price!!! Interesting thread, but as Jay said, you are preaching to the choir. Those that don't use this sight constructively likely don't hang out long and are long gone.

[John Hawkins]

see.... you even get 20.00 words, logarithmically.

[Dave Leroy]

Twenty bucks is dirt cheap for what you can get on this site.

I don't want this to be a back handed compliment for BPN, but as Ofer has mentioned, there is not another website out there where one can get honest critiques done by mod's, pro's, semi-pro's and amateurs.
The comments cover all aspects of photography including lighting, composition, exposure, equipment, and post processing.
Sometimes the number of comments is pretty thin, buy hey that is all part of the experience and learning.

Another aspect of this site which should not be overlooked is the ETL forum. Again no backhanded compliment but I have not seen another similar forum at other sites. It is a great spot to get started and build up some skill as well as confidence.

To top it off you get to post one photo per forum every 24 hours and get critiqued. You can't get that on an online course for a couple hundred dollars.

I think this is a good opportunity to thank the owners, the moderators, and the generous posters who have stuck it out through the thick and thin and have kept the site ticking along.

Thanks.

Dave

[Nick Palmieri]

"see.... you even get 20.00 words, logarithmically"

Guess I should have said "exponentially"

[arash_hazeghi]

The main advantage of BPN is honest critique. Unlike most other sites, it's not a place for sugar coating soft photos :eek::S3:

Although BPN is not perfect (nothing is) and sometimes critiques go off track, overall it helps you a lot more in finding your flaws and improve your skills. There are other sites where people post their photos mainly for showcase and display rather than feedback, as a result nobody learns anything. When the standards become low and people applaud every mediocre image the incentive and motivation for progress and taking better photographs will be lost and it just becomes like another photo sharing site with a bunch of nice comments.

The other advantage of BPN is larger posting size, well 1024 pixels is not really large anymore given this day's cameras and displays but it is better than those 800 pixel images. The small images hide the imperfections and makes it difficult to see the details so that's a big plus for BPN.

Given the above $20 is really nothing, even if you get a single photograph as a result of the stuff you learn here that you otherwise wouldn't be able to, you have technically got your money back :S3:

In fact I would be willing to pay more so capitain Shadle would have more funds in fixing/improving the IT issues!

[John Chardine]

For those interested in comparative shopping:

Annual memberships:
naturescapes.net: $40
naturephotographers.net: $49

But as folks have said, it's not about the money. BPN is unique. Unique means there's nothing else like it.

[Doug Brown]

Well put Ofer. :S3:

[Harshad Barve]

Many Guru's who teaches me many things about photography and many many friends across the globe who keeps on watching my work ,

20 USD are very few my friend :S3:

[Hilary Hann]

I agree with Harshad completely.

[Kaustubh Deshpande]

$20 shud be an afterthought, really. BPN offers so much that I wont even know where to start. What I like a lot is you get real critiques, lots of helpful tips and different viewpoints. Not only what...but why something in an image does not work...why something works....you dont easilly get that sort of feedback on the net. If there is ketchup on my shirt, I appreciate friends who tell me that. And I thank everyone at BPN for fostering that culture here.

I've been doing bird photography for 2 years and have been participating on BPN for those two years....the amount I have learnt would have taken me years( or never) otherwise. Glad I picked the right forum when starting out....

[Lorant Voros]

Looks like a popular thread :-).

I think the pictures speak for themselves. You can can see the first photo I posted when I joined and you can see what kind of pictures I take now. And on the top of it this is the only forum of such a kind. I am amazed how people spend a time to really look at the pictures and give a constructive critic on them. The members here are the best of the world and they have the vision of taking care of our planet. Just by looking at pictures and reading the critics I learn more than from any book.

I am happy to be here and it is my best spent 20$ a year. Thank you everyone on BPN.

Lorant

[Don Railton]

I think its the best value one can buy to improve their photography, no matter how good they think they are.

DON

[Chris Brennan]

I've been a photographer for about 40 years, but only a bird photographer for the last 4 or 5. There's not been one source in those years where I've learned more from my peers and those with much more experience than I any better than BPN! Much of the information gleaned from this site is priceless... and easily worth the measly $20 it costs. It's a incredible bargain!

[Chris Baker]

Have you learnt anything from BPN and is it worth the membership fee?

Tons and it's worth every penny. I've only been at this for about 5 years and used to be a member of another site with the sugar coated comments. Whilst on vacation on Florida I met a BPN member who put me on to this site and I haven't looked back since. I was only a participant here for the first few months but gained so much I actually felt guilty not paying. The gems passed on in the critiques alone have really helped me along the way never mind all the goodies in the Educational Forum. Rock on!

[Rachel Hollander]

Missed this thread while I was away. I think I've learned more about photography and post-processing in the last year on BPN than anywhere else including workshops, books and on other websites. Best $20 I've spent on my photography. I've also connected with some great people.

[christopher galeski]

well worth 20$,great sight,wish I had found it earlier,good critics,learnt a lot.thanks BPN.:S3: