Nikon AF/VR Problem

[Wheeler McDougal Jr.]

I would like to ask a question regarding the relationship between auto focus and VR. I am a Nikon shooter and am using a D3S with a Nikkor 600mm F/4.0 w/(AF and VR). I often go down to the Illinois River and practice shooting flying Sea Gulls of one kind or another with this equipment or sometimes with a Nikkor 200 - 400mm f/4.0 w/(AF and VR) or a Nikkor 70 - 200mm f/2.6 w/(AF and VR). I have always used both the AF and the VR "ON". I have had a terrible time trying to get the camera and lens to lock onto the bird, at time it seems almost impossible. I have tried many different combinations of number of focusing points with 9 points being the best overall option and the center point focus point. Sometimes the bird is quite close to me and I can't get it to lock and even get acceptable focus. Today I was using the 600mm with the VR "on" and I was experiencing a great deal of trouble and so out of great frustration I shut the VR to "OFF" presto I began getting the most beautifully sharp focused images. IS there someone that can explain to me why this works this way? I have a feeling I am not the first to have experienced this, but I would sure like to know why, as I bought the lens believing that the VR would be helpful in getting a sharper image. Evidently unwittingly so. Can you direct me to help?<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
Wheeler McDougal Jr.<o:p></o:p>

[Randy Stout]

Wheeler:

This should be a killer combination, the best action body out there, with a fine set of glass.

Are you shooting off a tripod or hand held?

I have included a link from Thom Hogan, on when to use VR on Nikon glass. A long but very interesting read, which might help you make sense of how to use the VR.


http://www.bythom.com/nikon-vr.htm


Cheers

Randy

[Desmond Chan]

And this:

http://www.bythom.com/autofocus2.htm


Also this:

http://nps.nikonimaging.com/technical_solutions/

[Desmond Chan]

Sometimes the bird is quite close to me and I can't get it to lock and even get acceptable focus.

Closer than the minimum focus distance? If so, not being able to focus is normal.


Today I was using the 600mm with the VR "on" and I was experiencing a great deal of trouble and so out of great frustration I shut the VR to "OFF" presto I began getting the most beautifully sharp focused images.I did notice that if the VR is off, the camera/lens seem to be able to get a focus lock faster.


IS there someone that can explain to me why this works this way? Don't exactly know the technical explanation, but I would guess it could be something like if the VR/IS is off, then the camera/lens or whatever has one less thing to do before locking the focus.


as I bought the lens believing that the VR would be helpful in getting a sharper image. It does, when used in the right circumstances. Having said that, I leave the VR on most of the time and the images don't seem to have suffered any noticeable negative effect from it.

[Wheeler McDougal Jr.]

Thanks for the help. Just to clear up a couple of questions you had. 1) No the bird is not so close that I would need to be at full focus as I have had the lens for over two years and know when you need to flip the switch. 2) This inability to get focus is reallly the inability to get any acceptable focus at all. I can follow the bird or watch it come at me and continually press the shutter release and not have the focus move at all, not in the least! If I take the image I will get a completely out of focus bird and afairly decent focused background. With the VR off I get a very quick focus lock and mostly a very crisp focus and I don't understand why. I will read your links and see if they help. 3) I was shooting today hand held, but it will act the same way off the tripod. Thanks again for your help.
Mac

[Ed Grella]

I would contact a Nikon service center. Your lens may have some type of VR calibration issue.
Ed

[John Ippolito]

If all of your VR lenses are acting in the same fashion, then it may be an auto focusing issue.
Another consideration is if your shutter activation is set to focus or shutter priority. Do you use focus prioity when shooting? In my experience, it will slow down/confuse focus acquisition when coupled with VR. I use shutter priority release for all moving subjects.

[Anthony Gomes]

I had a similar problem with my 600 Vr. I tried lens align and many other things. For me, as reported by others, I set the VR to tripod mode while I use the lens on a wimberly and it worked. I sent the lens and camera to Nikon ( do you know how much it costs To insure a 600mm Vr lens?) Nikon recomends this also. The manual says many things, including this. The VR on the 600 seems to be quite different.It produces great pictures without the VR, However I have mine on all the time in the Tripod mode. I also use the 500 non vr and I get very sharp pictures.

Tony

[Wheeler McDougal Jr.]

First, John, I do use continuous servo AF and not Single-servo. Second, Tony, I will try switching to tripod mode, but I was hand holding the lens when I discovered the difference between acquisition times between VR 'ON' and 'OFF'. I will be out again in the next few days and try mounting it on my Wimberly and see if there is a difference. One other thing I am going to try is to set menu item a8 to 11 focus points. If I understand this option correctly I should get a little faster startup AF due to the fact that the camera only has to look at 11 points instead of 51.

As an aside, I think a lot of people have asumed that I am not getting sharp infocus images from the 600mm with the VR 'ON', this could not be further from the truth. The problem is one of acquisistion, the lens will not acquire the target with the VR 'ON' and when I turn it 'OFF' it will. It is just that simple. I seem to have the trouble with the other ling lenses I own but I am not as sure with them as I am with the 600.

Thanks again for all your trouble as I appreciate all of your thoughts on this mater as it is very frustrating.

[Anthony Gomes]

Hi
The problem I had was that my pictures were ever so slightly unsharp. I compared the 600 and 500 images. I thought that the image acquisition was fine, but the focus was off. Lens Align worked but adjustments were not repeatable and seemed specific to the distance calibrated, I was getting +18, -15 etc all over the place.
My understanding of VR on long lenses is that the mode depends on whether the gimbal head is locked down or not. For unlocked heads the amplitude of the vibrations is high with a low frequency. And locked heads the amplitude of the vibrations is low and the frequency is higher. So I assume that the Tripod mode is the locked down mode and the manual says this, but the manual goes on to say that you if the normal mode does not work use the Tripod mode, for the unlocked head. I rationalized that the carbon fibre Tripods and the Wimberly heads are much more steady or even more crazy Nikon expected and designed the lens and normal mode for a ball head on an aluminum tripod. (The amplitude and frequency are different for the aluminum versus the carbon fibre tripods.

Also for Nikon cameras I use in camera sharpening, by using this my pictures are much sharper. With no in camera sharpening I could not get that crisp focus even with Photoshop and third party sharpeners

I also tried AF and Live View focusing and there was a difference with live view being much sharper showing the true capability of the lens.

I am intrigued and puzzled by your lack of acquisition. The 600 is demanding of technique and magnifies errors. Read Thom Hogan's article, I think he did imply that VR could negate focus at times.

Wish you luck let me know how it turns out.

Tony

[Desmond Chan]

The problem is one of acquisistion, the lens will not acquire the target with the VR 'ON' and when I turn it 'OFF' it will. It is just that simple. I seem to have the trouble with the other ling lenses I own but I am not as sure with them as I am with the 600.

You've probably known but, just in case, do you let the VR settle in before you press the shutter button? I think what I'm trying to say is if you press the shutter button while the VR is doing its thing, then you can get blurred image. Do you set the shutter button in such a way that it can open the shutter whether the subject is in focus or not?